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Sterbefall
08-06-2009, 11:37 AM
My current gear (and spec)
Profiler - Wowhead (http://profiler.wowhead.com/?profile=12038731)

In 3.1, my single target threat wasn't so hot (not for lack of stats, a point shy of hit cap, 40 expertise), but as long as I had some hate on me, my Rune Strikes (macro bound to every attack) would keep me barely ahead of other tanks.

Since 3.2 is a different story and my ST threat has gotten worse. I expected a loss in AoE threat (loss of UB), but with the fact that I'm now dumping excess RP into Death Coils (enhanced by UB), I expected to overcome and maybe come out ahead of the Scourge Strike nerf. Not so. Other (lesser geared) tanks like warriors and paladins seem to pull ahead of me no problem and might even be overtaking me in AoE threat.

I'm thinking about going Frost or Blood (see specs below), but I have concerns about Frost's cooldowns (UA doesn't compare to VB or Bone Shield for boss big slow hits) and Blood's AoE capability (not sure if BB spam is strong enough).
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EhZhxxxA0Ikc0buzAo0x:Tka0Mm)
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EGVh0IcbofssxhxZ0gh:ipG)

Thoughts? I sometimes read that Blood's AoE is "good enough" but that's not terribly reassuring.

Hades
08-06-2009, 11:02 PM
That frost build looks good, but you seem fixated on Scent of Blood. RP is good, but SoB doesn't have enough benefit imo to remedy that. Also, you're using a two-hander, so why not pick up the two-hander talent for better threat? Since you're doing Ulduar stuff, I'm going to assume you have access to the gear you're gonna need for a blood spec, which requires more tabbing between trash kinda like a warrior. Frost, imo.. is GOD for DK tanking. I've never tried unholy, and I agree that UA is borderline worthless unless it's glyphed, but for AoE threat, Frost is the way to go. You'll hear quite a bit that there's no better massive snap aggro than a deathchilled Howling Blast, an from personal experience, I agree! Thus, if you go with a frost build, I'd switch out the Frost Strike glyph on your build via wowhead for a glyph of UA to make it a worthwhile talent.

Edgewalker
08-06-2009, 11:12 PM
My current gear (and spec)
Profiler - Wowhead (http://profiler.wowhead.com/?profile=12038731)

In 3.1, my single target threat wasn't so hot (not for lack of stats, a point shy of hit cap, 40 expertise), but as long as I had some hate on me, my Rune Strikes (macro bound to every attack) would keep me barely ahead of other tanks.

Since 3.2 is a different story and my ST threat has gotten worse. I expected a loss in AoE threat (loss of UB), but with the fact that I'm now dumping excess RP into Death Coils (enhanced by UB), I expected to overcome and maybe come out ahead of the Scourge Strike nerf. Not so. Other (lesser geared) tanks like warriors and paladins seem to pull ahead of me no problem and might even be overtaking me in AoE threat.

I'm thinking about going Frost or Blood (see specs below), but I have concerns about Frost's cooldowns (UA doesn't compare to VB or Bone Shield for boss big slow hits) and Blood's AoE capability (not sure if BB spam is strong enough).
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EhZhxxxA0Ikc0buzAo0x:Tka0Mm)
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EGVh0IcbofssxhxZ0gh:ipG)

Thoughts? I sometimes read that Blood's AoE is "good enough" but that's not terribly reassuring.

SoB is very nice for frost, but not terribly needed for Blood. Subversion is better if threat is a concern. You could drop Imp. Icy Touch if another DK had it in the raid, and WoTN, and pick up Necrosis also. WoTN is really nice for a few select encounters, for most it is also not very useful.
Blood's AoE is extremely good. DnD and Blood Boil are more than adequate, and Heart Strike has a built in cleave in addition to being the cheapest rune nuke. Also Signet of the Impregnable Fort and dropping a couple of blues for 10 def/15 stams would easily hit defense cap if you wanted to not be food or elixir reliant.

Sterbefall
08-07-2009, 06:34 AM
Thanks guys. I didn't see your replies until this morning. I decided to try out the Blood spec I linked and the AoE threat is definitely good enough, maybe even better when you focus on AoE instead of ST threat. There's something about converting 6 runes (4 death, two blood) into rapid fire Blood Boil that makes me giddy.

I'm probably a little more obsessed with SoB than I need to be (considering we almost always have a resto druid), but I like to macro Rune Strike into every attack and I'm paranoid that I might not have enough RP for CD activation. I might shift those points out of my Blood spec, but honestly, I'm so happy with my threat now I don't know what to do with myself.

I liked Frost the last time I tried it, but even glyphed, UA just doesn't seem strong for anything but trash/multi mob tanking. It's certainly not reassuring for fights like Vezax and Surges (IBF + VB worked great last night). I still like the Frost Strike Glyph because it helps push my ST threat higher (though with FS and SotVH nerfs, less so after patch) with more FS.

I'm actually way over defense cap (Wowhead's profiler doesn't understand Rune of SSG). I'll probably dump that Sand Worn Band once I get the tank ring out of the new 5 man.

Bottom line for me seems to be that Blood tanking is king, though I might revisit Frost should they fix UA to be workable for slow, big hit bosses. Thanks again.