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Miagorme
08-05-2009, 09:21 PM
Hi, I'd like to say I'm a pretty knowledgeable DK tank, I read up on everything and have looked at every possible source of information I could. The changes didn't look too devastating, but I decided to try out dual wielding frost. I have 41 expertise and have been parried three times by a boss in a 6 minute fight.

My problem is I got completely gibbed in the 25 man normal Trial of the Crusade by the first boss. He hits with impale and his normal hit, and I'm pretty much dead. I figured the boss was just really hard, so I didn't think too much of it. We went to 25 uld afterwards, and Razorscale took me to 1k health with one shot. It wasn't a crit. I'm really uncertain with what's going on, as I have roughly 8% more avoidance at the cost of 2k health, and I just got The Black Heart for the armor procs. Even with bad luck, there's no way I should be getting gibbed and utterly wrecked so easily.

I've got all new gems, and I've got my rotation down, and I use my cooldowns at appropriate times. I'm really not sure why I'm getting gibbed, as even if Blood is superior at the moment, the difference shouldn't be THAT vast. Could somebody please help me understand what's going on? Did they raise the uncrittable level or something? Does the difference in specs (blood's self-heals taking a lot of pressure off of the healers) make Frost much harder to heal? I could really use some help. (Armory isn't updated at the moment. Look in post for stats.)

The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Lightninghoof&n=Mi%C3%A2)

Thank you.

edit: I don't really care if I have to go respec back to 2h blood, I just wanted to see if other DK tanks were having the same magnitude of trouble I am having. Not trying to complain or anything, just trying to see if I'm doing something really wrong or if the dw frost/2h blood difference is just that big. =)

Note: Gear I logged out in is what I frost tank in. Spec is DPS, since I did a test DW Frost DPS since I was pretty sure I wasn't keeping the DW Frost Tank spec I had.

Note2: Sorry for not posting in the other threads, I didn't want to derail and I have slightly (majorly, in most of the case) different questions and reasons for posting.

Gumurak
08-06-2009, 08:50 AM
The main thing that i see is that your spec does not have anticipation. Your dodge rating is really really low. Therefore you are eating an insane amount of damage.

it might be a personal preference, but the folks at elitestjerks have already shown that dual weilding a tank spec and not being at the parry expertise cap (i.e 53) will get your teeth kicked in pretty quick. But at this point youd have to rearrange gear to get yourself to the 283 hit cap.

The only real thing I can see is the lack of anticipation at a first glance. i'll have to wait until I am done raiding to inch through your spec. But I'm sure the rest of it is fine.

Edit--- Took another quick look while we had downtime. Toughness and Frigid Dreadplate are also off your spec. I'd re-evaluate these talents. I'd also drop improved icy talons. Unless you don't run with a shaman, then I might consider it.

this is the armory for a friend of mine. He's not as nicely geared but its the spec I would recommend.

The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Thorium+Brotherhood&n=Kilobyte&group=1)


I should also fully read your post to realize that is your dps dual weild spec. But still, use the above mentioned tanking spec and you should be fine. Anything else outside of that spec I'm not sure about. but if you are 540 defense and still getting gibbed with the gear and 540 defense. Then I would start looking at your healers.

Miagorme
08-06-2009, 12:40 PM
My healers were probably very used to healing me as blood, where I supported them a lot. I'm trying 2h Blood tonight and I'll see how it goes. Maybe dual wield tanking just isn't ready yet.

crazymuncy
08-06-2009, 02:40 PM
Im having the same problem. 1st boss in 25 man Trail of the Crusade eat me for dinner even with me using cooldowns. after we downed him we went to 25 man uld and razor hit me for 30k twice in about 3 seconds. i was using the same spec with better gear then the week before and ive tanked him for months now. anyone yet figure this out yet?

Prestonite
08-06-2009, 04:21 PM
Same problem, I had to respec my build a little to compensate for the re-arranged talents. I tried my best and picking the best available options.
Threat & Aggro are not the problem. I feel like I am cut down like knife through butter. Fully buffed in Raids I have 38K health (food+flask).

Either my armor rating sucks now or the patched has nerfed me a lot and I have yet to adjust. Any tips would be appreciated.

Frost Build:
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Shadowmoon&n=Prestonite&group=1)

Gumurak
08-06-2009, 06:13 PM
Prestonite, I'm not sure what to tell you because I can't tell if you are dps or tank with your current armory. If it is your current armory your defense is way too low.

Here is the cookie cutter build........

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055320000000000000000000000305050003 5203300030125101351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=131820000000&version=9757

Rotations....

Single Target Rotation - IT-BS-OB-(Blood Tap if no Death Rune)OB RPDUMP = RS/FS
Alt-Single Target Rotation - HB-BS-BS-OB OB-OB-OB RPDUMP = RS/FS (assumes HB Glyph)
Multi Target Rotation - DnD-IT-PS-Pest then TAB-HB/Pest/BloodBoil RPDUMP = RS/FS

540 defense and 26 expertise are really suggested for these builds for obvious reasons. Obviously you don't want to dual weild tank with these builds. Unless you are running the total expertise cap. Resilence has been deemed inefficent for these builds. Also with the current state of dk tanking, going over 540 rather than riding it has much better benefits than previously exepected. Also I would gem for stam other than completeing meta.

Information pulled between here and elitistjerks.

Miagorme
08-07-2009, 01:45 AM
I did much better as 2h Blood. I know pretty much all there is to know about most specs excluding unholy, but that didn't help me understand why I got completely gibbed. The other tank was a Paladin. When the boss hit 4 stacks, I had to taunt more times than he did. He'd taunt first, and his ardent defender probably went off. Two minutes definitely passed before he had to taunt again, so I'm pretty sure that's what made it seem like I was incredibly inferior.

Same thing happened today except I didn't die (only died once when our main healer had an interrupting add on him, but that doesn't count :D) and it was very noticeable that we took the same amount of damage. New chest shows how the run went. :D

Gumurak
08-07-2009, 03:05 AM
Well it's a very interesting question to say the least. I unfortunantly can't provide one for you. I've gone over every inch of your gear. Nothing is out of place except for minor differences in your spec.

Lack of toughness lowered your armor values. Somehow i doubt this caused a tremendous difference in you getting gibbed. Unless of course it put your armor much lower than expected. Anything under 21k would have caused a considerable difference. But I don't think it would have been that hard of a gibbing.

The fact that you didn't have Improved Frost presence may be another. But then agian the cookie cutter build that I supplied is off on the current talents and tooltips. And thats given if the spec you mentioned was your actual tanking spec. Which you clearly stated was not. So i hope you find an answer to this, as i would be interested in finding the answer myself.

renzime
08-07-2009, 03:46 AM
it might be worth noting that if you are only just crit immune 540-545 you will take the occasional insain hit, i dont know whats changed for it to do this, but i was pretty much being eaten alive in crusader / razor xt hodir and vezax till i swapped a few peices of gear around for more defense and avoidance.

:D how ever i have to say xt is far more fun than it was even if it is bugged being rushed by 20+ bomb bots and 60+ scrapbots is some thing to behold in deed.

Domiy
08-07-2009, 05:52 AM
Noticed quite the same thing as you on the Trial of the Crusade, but we did 10 man. Before the patch i was a better survival tank then our pally, but this boss just seems to totally smack me down and our palla had no problems tanking 4/5 stacks at all o0 We went Ulduar 10 afterwards.. well no problems there at all ( although i cant see my received hits quite clear since my parrot is not functioning >.<)

Prestonite
08-07-2009, 07:50 AM
I'm pretty sure I logged out with tank spec and gear this time if anyone wants to look.

imdeck
08-07-2009, 08:18 AM
(First time poster, long time reader)

I'm having the same problems as the OP. I've been one of our guild's MT/OTs for a few months now without much problems. I tanked pretty much everything with no real problems.

Last night, we went to 25 Uld and XT crushed me. Yes, I lost about 6k hp and 3k AC -- wrong thread for QQing.

Anyways, I dug into the grimreaper of XT killing me:

10 melee attacks made against me:
-8 of them had IBF up
-6 of them had Vamp Blood up
-5 of them had Furnace Stone-use effect up
-4 of them had The Black Heart proc up

of that, I only avoided 2 of the 10 (all my grim would show accurately), and the average hit on me was 23-25k WITH all those CDs up.

Needless to say, I'll be dpsing now, I suppose as our warrior/pally can do better than that.

I'm logged out in dps gear, but I'm in 4 piece conq, 2h exp capped (blood tank), and almost hit capped. Warrior never took a hit larger than 23k with or without CDs popped.

Alas, I lament.

Prestonite
08-07-2009, 12:11 PM
I guess I could try the cookie cutter build, but am curious to what changed so much that my gear feels "broke". I feel as if I am no longer a viable tank option.

imdeck
08-07-2009, 12:27 PM
I guess I could try the cookie cutter build, but am curious to what changed so much that my gear feels "broke". I feel as if I am no longer a viable tank option.

This is the way I feel also. I stepped down from tanking until I figure out what I'm doing wrong.

Miagorme
08-07-2009, 12:49 PM
2h Blood is still viable. My problem was with DW Frost, I have been doing much better with 2h Blood, just a little under where I was in 3.1. Most of it's about psychology, so in short, just stop thinking you're a trash tank. You'll get hit, and you'll get hit for ~1k more than you used to. Get used to it. It's not so bad, it just means DK tanks will need more gear/skill/strategy than in 3.1. Looking at the gear available in 3.2, if those nerfs hadn't came, we'd of sat at ~50k unbuffed, ~32k armor unbuffed, and ~29% dodge, 27% parry.

Gumurak
08-08-2009, 12:51 AM
Well I've looked at your gear agian. And I'm not sure if thats your tanking like you said before or not. Because it's showing you at 440 defense. Which is 100 under the cap. It might be beneficial at this point for you to equip your gear and your frost tanking build and take a screenshot and post it. As it's getting hard to evaluate. i also suggest getting the new black heart trinket. 5-6% reduction in damage is nothing to sneeze at.

Missgunst
08-08-2009, 02:27 AM
(First time poster, long time reader)

I'm having the same problems as the OP. I've been one of our guild's MT/OTs for a few months now without much problems. I tanked pretty much everything with no real problems.

Last night, we went to 25 Uld and XT crushed me. Yes, I lost about 6k hp and 3k AC -- wrong thread for QQing.

Anyways, I dug into the grimreaper of XT killing me:

10 melee attacks made against me:
-8 of them had IBF up
-6 of them had Vamp Blood up
-5 of them had Furnace Stone-use effect up
-4 of them had The Black Heart proc up

of that, I only avoided 2 of the 10 (all my grim would show accurately), and the average hit on me was 23-25k WITH all those CDs up.

Needless to say, I'll be dpsing now, I suppose as our warrior/pally can do better than that.

I'm logged out in dps gear, but I'm in 4 piece conq, 2h exp capped (blood tank), and almost hit capped. Warrior never took a hit larger than 23k with or without CDs popped.

Alas, I lament.

I got a question about your gear, because I don't see how you can get to "almost hit capped", being expertise caped, and wearing 4 piece conq. I mean you have to have some disadvantages on that gear, and that would explain why you get hit so hard (and so often).


I tanked everything up until now and I also have to say, that the nerf hit us really hard.
My problem is that I can't see when me or my healers will get in trouble. Before the patch you could tell, I mean you got experience and stuff, but now it's all different. One of the main problems is, that the healers have to change their playstyle when they heal you. On the one hand you don't have IBF on the 60 second CD anymore, so you will automatically get a lot more damage. But the other thing is, they can't rely on you having any CD now. I usally tanked through the Surge on Vezax, just using IBF when he casted it. Now I have to tell my healers when to get me a cooldown, because IBF may not be rdy.
The thing is I nearly got best in slot gear (missing Thorim ring is all I think) and I get raped by Ulduar bosses atm. I lost nearly 2-3k Life, although I got all new epic gems *sigh*

I'm not quite sure how to handle this, I still favorite blood on the most bosses, since VB and DS really help my healers. My other specc is frost since wether blood nor unholy can tank AE anymore (Trash / Thorim).
What I really changed is that I now always take a indistructable potion right before the pull so that I have the buff and can reapply it infight. I only did those for the Hardmodes, now I really have to do that for every boss.

Prestonite
08-08-2009, 09:38 AM
i also suggest getting the new black heart trinket. 5-6% reduction in damage is nothing to sneeze at.

What vendor is that from?

Ok logged out again in frost \ tank gear and it updated.

Missgunst
08-08-2009, 01:57 PM
I think it dropps out of the new 5man instance, but dunno if heroic or normal mode is needed.

Miagorme
08-08-2009, 04:46 PM
Well I've looked at your gear agian. And I'm not sure if thats your tanking like you said before or not. Because it's showing you at 440 defense. Which is 100 under the cap. It might be beneficial at this point for you to equip your gear and your frost tanking build and take a screenshot and post it. As it's getting hard to evaluate. i also suggest getting the new black heart trinket. 5-6% reduction in damage is nothing to sneeze at.
I change my gear very often, from DPS, DW DPS, tank, DW tank, pvp, frost PVP, etc. -- what I'm in now is my tank set, though:

The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Lightninghoof&n=Mi%C3%A2)

It's a pretty good guess that if I was at 440 defense, I wasn't in my tank gear, heh, or maybe you were talking to Prestonite. It wasn't very clear.

KT6884
08-08-2009, 05:38 PM
I think it dropps out of the new 5man instance, but dunno if heroic or normal mode is needed.

It does drop out of the new 5man TOC dungeon. I got it on regular off of the last boss and it procs ALL THE TIME. :D

+146 Stamina
Chance on any melee attack to gain 7k armor for 10 seconds

Oh yeah, and no cool down muhahahaha

Edgewalker
08-08-2009, 05:49 PM
I change my gear very often, from DPS, DW DPS, tank, DW tank, pvp, frost PVP, etc. -- what I'm in now is my tank set, though:

The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Lightninghoof&n=Mi%C3%A2)

It's a pretty good guess that if I was at 440 defense, I wasn't in my tank gear, heh, or maybe you were talking to Prestonite. It wasn't very clear.

Dancing Rune Weapon doesn't add to personal threat. If you wanted to gain a little threat and keep Rune Tap, I would reccomend dropping Mark of Blood and DRW for 2/3 Subversion. If you wanted to gain a lot of threat at very little loss, drop Rune Tap and Imp. Rune Tap, Drop Mark of Blood, Drop DRW, and put 3/3 in Subversion and the rest in Necrosis.

Other than that, your gear looks fine for all forms of tanking. I would guess it's just a mental block.

Miagorme
08-08-2009, 11:00 PM
My threat is fine, except when the pally tank is being a dumbass and decides to dps with wings up along with righteous fury 15 seconds after we pull. Other than that, I'm not worried about threat. Losing mark of blood and rune tap is a HUGE cost, as self heals is the strength of blood. DRW is there to put more diseases up on the target, acting as another cooldown to chain with Empower Rune Weapon for bigger heals from Deathstrike during tough, expected burst damage such as Plasma Blast from Mimiron. Not sure if DRW's diseases improve DS, but one point certainly can't do much harm.

Dhalphir
08-08-2009, 11:31 PM
if your tank spec really didnt have maxed points in Toughness and Anticipation, you pretty much fail at designing tank specs.

Esch
08-08-2009, 11:37 PM
It does drop out of the new 5man TOC dungeon. I got it on regular off of the last boss and it procs ALL THE TIME. :D

+146 Stamina
Chance on any melee attack to gain 7k armor for 10 seconds

Oh yeah, and no cool down muhahahaha


The Black Heart (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=47216) (Estimated 45sec ICD) Note that if you're not chain pulling, you eat up some of the ICD timer between pulls, making it seem to proc 'every pull'.



Other than that, I'm not worried about threat. Losing mark of blood and rune tap is a HUGE cost, as self heals is the strength of blood. ... Not sure if DRW's diseases improve DS, but one point certainly can't do much harm.

I can agree with Rune Tap myself, though MoB is going to heal for 2k on a 50k HP tank. Assuming the healing is applied after a hit, you need to survive the blow before what MoB does matters, IMO. I dropped MoB as a result. As for diseases, I suspect DRW's diseases don't count towards your DS healing, just as the threat is attributed to DRW instead of you.

If you have a free point, DRW can be a useful spot, but there are better options.

Miagorme
08-09-2009, 12:09 AM
if your tank spec really didnt have maxed points in Toughness and Anticipation, you pretty much fail at designing tank specs.
Agreed.

@Esch: Mark of Blood is very situational, and helpful in many fights. I use it more as a raid tool than a cooldown such as IBF. While MoB wouldn't be useful if I was at 20k health and the boss was about to hit me for 21k, it would be useful if I dodged/parried the last 8 attacks and the likeliness of a chain of damaging blows would land is high. 4% of my max health every time I take damage is very helpful, and it's often just enough to give the healers extra space.

An added perspective is if the boss hits for 20k, and I get healed for 2k, it's a 10% damage reduction that can be boosted by abilities such as Guardian Spirit, Vampiric Blood, and anything else that increases healing taken.

It just adds up and a use-talent is more effective than a passive one, when used correctly.

Zivh
08-09-2009, 01:17 AM
It just adds up and a use-talent is more effective than a passive one, when used correctly.

Again:



...when used correctly.

What about if not used correctly? Or what about if you get stunned and can't pop it in time? Or what about your GCD? Or what about if you have a brain fart and can't find your button? Or what if a spider crawls across your foot while you're about to click it and instead you click unholy presence?

The list could go on forever. I think use abilities are great, don't get me wrong, but having the general survivability ALL THE TIME is WAY more important.

Personally, I dropped MoB for the reasons listed above by Esch...2k on a 50k tank is really almost nothing, plus if youre gonna die from the hit, that heal will never get to you, therefore it was wasted completely. You are far better off with the fully talented Rune Tap followed by an IBF and a pot than dropping MoB on a boss that hits for 25k.

DRW is a completely useless tanking talent and I find it quite disturbing that anyone would think that one talent point in there is more effective than one talent point in something that may actually assist your tanking.

Sorry if it sounds douchey, but seriously...DRW? Come on.......

Miagorme
08-10-2009, 09:49 AM
I use my abilities correct all the time, I racial out of stuns when needed, I do pop it in time, I monitor GCD and GCD does not effect Rune Tap anyways, and use Blood Tap if I need a quick Rune Tap/Mark, I know where all my buttons are, and I'm not a clicker.

:P

2k on a 50k tank indeed isn't much, but keep in mind that it's 20 damaging attacks, without a cooldown. This can make a big difference in any situation. Any way you look at it, 2k heal instantly after a hit = 2k less damage taken, unless the hit kills. If the hit kills, one point in another talent wouldn't have saved me anyways. 2k less damage taken = completely worth it for just ONE point and ONE blood rune.

I'll probably spec out of DRW next time I respec, but I'm not going to respec for one point. I hadn't known the diseases DRW applies don't effect my own DS. Thanks for that information!

Prestonite
08-10-2009, 01:28 PM
I just logged out with my new defense gear on, i am -1 def cap w/o relic on proc. Which is never. So far I have been feeling less like butter.

Tilley
08-11-2009, 11:21 PM
Mia,
I noticed in the two links you provided that your armory is showing a hit cap of 5% (203) I am new to tanking and tnew to wow for that matter and i am not 100 percent but isnt the hit cap for level 83 mobs 8 percent? this could be why you were missing the boss. Like i said i am new and trying to help and I also need help..
I was wondering if anyone has any insight onto a good solid build with the new changes from 3.2 I see a lot of people talking about the changes etc.. and what works for them but have yet to see a solid build or list of tank builds since the new patch.

Thanks..
Tilley

Mongia
08-12-2009, 02:07 AM
Hello

I'm having the same problems are described here and I dont think any amount of gear / talent tweaking is going to resolve this.

I went into the patch as Blood tank but was getting instagibbed while 5 man heroic farming with Ulduar geared healers and DPS. I changed to Frost (Unbreakakle armor is very good against getting hit lots of times a small amount) and found my survivabilty to be better, but still not what I would expect for my gear.

I still feel incredibly weak compared to my guild's warrior and pally tank, despite having virtually the same level of gear.

I'm not new to this but at the moment it feels like something is not working with DK tank and I feel like im letting my guild down but tanking because I don't trust myself to not get smashed with crazy spike damage suddenly.

I wonder if it is a scaling thing where they have nerfed us because the new t9 items are going to scale better on us than they do on the other tanks. In the meantime we might as well be clad in cloth and will never gear to gear up as tank because why would a guild want to gear up a tank that cant tank?

One thing I am aware of that needs fixing in my gear is my Expertise. I had to regem/re-enchant quite a bit to compensate for the lost stamina from the patch so my previous 25 expertise is looking pretty shocking now

The World of Warcraft Armory (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Neptulon&n=Mongia)

Self-buffed:
28% dodge
20% parry
25.5k armor
31.5k Health

This was the build I was using prior to changing to Frost on the offchance it was my Build that was killing me:

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0355221530303313200220131300305000000 00000000000000000000005230000000000000000000000000 0&glyph=102026050406&version=10192

Going to go back to this later tonight but would appreciate anyone's feedback they might be able to offer

toonnamefail
08-12-2009, 04:33 PM
2k on a 50k tank indeed isn't much, but keep in mind that it's 20 damaging attacks, without a cooldown. This can make a big difference in any situation. Any way you look at it, 2k heal instantly after a hit = 2k less damage taken, unless the hit kills. If the hit kills, one point in another talent wouldn't have saved me anyways. 2k less damage taken = completely worth it for just ONE point and ONE blood rune.

Big Fat N, for one its not 20 damaging attacks, its 20 stacks over 20s and you would be lucky to see 10 heals from that...

Im with Zivh in the sense that I just cannot fathom why tanks spec into things like MoB and Imp BP, the pitiful amount of heals recieved by either talent is only going to end up being a pitiful amount of overheal from your healers. IF you think these talents are somewhat helpful I would strongly suggest teaching your healers how to reactively heal, just because you die, doesn't neccesarily mean there is something you are going to fix within your toon.


Oh and DRW = *sigh*

Gumurak
08-17-2009, 08:22 AM
Ya, I was just stating what I saw in your armory. At this point, I'd trade out the essence of gossamer for your monarch crab. The mitigation from essence is highly under the new trinket. And the dodge is exceptionally better as a dk tank.

Leiferon
08-25-2009, 02:47 PM
I'm having some of the same problems but on a more casual level. I run around with some friends and we only play a few times a week so we are mostly running Heroics, Naxx, and 5 man H:ToC. Post patch if I'm not with a really well geared healer I die ... I just take so much damage that the healer has to focus most of his energy on healing me.

I know DKs fairly well. I'm using a cookie cutter frost tanking 2h build. I don't have any trouble with holding agro. I'm just hoping to increase my survivability some how. I've considered going 2h blood to see if it is much better.

My armory is The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bronzebeard&n=Leiferon)

I swear there are some Heroic bosses that can 2 shot me if I'm unlucky. Even with all cool downs popped I can't seem to tank for compared to a pally/warrior. Any ideas? I know my gear is meh... but for the dungeons I'm running it should be enough. As I upgrade I'm trying to pump up stam and dodge/parry.

Missgunst
08-31-2009, 01:33 AM
You're stacking a lot of defense Rating which is really not so good. After reaching 540 Defense, you should not stack Def Gems anymore. You also got the wrong weapon enchant, you should use Glyph of Stone Gargoyle which gives you alot of defense and stamina. With that enchant you should be able to get rid of a lot of Def Gems and maybe even use stamina Dragons Eyes.
You only got 26k Life which is really not a lot, so that is why it's hard to heal you. Bosses in Heros can give you a lot of damage with one hit, so you need to have enough HP to survive another one.
It also looks as if you try to always get the socket bonus, which is not an important thing to do. When you are defense capped you should only socket Stamina Gems, no matter if the socket bonus is missed with them.

Leiferon
09-01-2009, 02:29 PM
I realized after I posted that the link doesn't have the right set of armor and isn't up to date regardless.

My def is sitting at 542 with 27.7K HP. I'll try switching the runeforging on my weapon. I've heard mixed review about boosting def beyond cap though recently for the sake of improving your avoidance (miss/parry/dodge). I hadn't really thought about gemming only for stam after def cap; I can try that. I'm a little worried if I'll have threat issues when my hit rating falls through the floor. I've also thought about trying blood tanking but not thrilled with the loss of aoe threat given how much aoe tanking I do.

I was in H:ToC last night trying to tank and it was very rough. My priest healer was mediocre geared. Even with rotating my cool downs (dodge trinket, IBF, and unbreakable armor) the Dark Knight was tearing me apart. After several failed tries I switched to dps and we brought in a guild Pally tank with worse gear then me who was able to tank the encounter while only pressing 3 buttons (Course he has 10K more hp). :(

Jameak
09-01-2009, 09:19 PM
I usally tanked through the Surge on Vezax, just using IBF when he casted it. Now I have to tell my healers when to get me a cooldown, because IBF may not be rdy.

You mean like every other tank has to? Hardly broken.