View Full Version : New Pally tank looking for help

08-04-2009, 02:02 AM
I've been playing the game for a few years now and after finaly deciding there's not much adventure in chucking fireballs at a boss or spaming flash heal on a tank I decided to reroll. It's been a few months and now that i have (Hopefull) all the noob kinks out of my gear I'm hoping for a once over to make sure I've got everything right.

The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Shandris&n=Jhin)

Is an armory link however in great dismay I see it has not been updated in two days. I have both the Tier 7 tank gloves and chest piece now.

What I'm really looking for is help with geming I'm all over the board with my gems. I'd also like some help with enchants and getting my health up to a managable level *26k unbuffed currently* without sacraficing the mitigation and avoidance I love

Thank you in advance

*small note* Fiery is on as a guild joke I know it's not a viable 80 enchant, I'll be getting the argent daily axe in a few days

08-04-2009, 07:36 AM
To be honest, only thing I'd really change from what I can see on the unupdated Armory, is replacing your weapon with one with defense on it, and regemming for Stam. Stam isn't everything for Naxx progression, and not even *that* crucial for starting Ulduar progression if your EH balance is high enough.

08-04-2009, 11:46 AM
Never gem for parry. If you want to match a socket bonuses (stam bonuses are the only ones worth trying to match, and not in all cases), +def+stam (green gem) for yellow sockets, +dodge+stam (purple gem) for red sockets, and obviously +24 stam gems for blue sockets. Put 16 defense on your cloak instead of agility. They just nerfed the agility to dodge conversion rate, and you'll need the defense rating from swapping your other gems.

Your spec is off in several places, and your glyph choices are bad. You absolutely need two points in Judgements Of the Just, not an optional talent. You need at least one point in improved judgements to make the 969 rotation work properly. Benediction is bad, don't put any points in it, anything else is better. Glyph of consecration is also bad for prot pallies, because it screws with the 969 rotation.

Your glyphs should be, Seal of Vengeance, Divine Plea, and Righeous Defense.

Looking at your spec and glyphs, there is no way you've been using a proper rotation. Do a search for "969 rotation", and learn it. If your DPS are at all decent, they will thank you.

08-04-2009, 12:02 PM
Hammer of the Righteous is a much better glyph than either Vengeance or RD imo.
And out of curiosity howcome you have Glyph of Salvation Akeber?

08-04-2009, 12:23 PM
Glyph of hammer of the righeous is purely a trash/aoe tank glyph. We're already one the best (if not THE best) aoe tanks in the game, an extra hit on HoTR is "meh".

Expertice reduces your chance to be parried by bosses. When a boss parries your attack his swing timer is hasted, making next attack come faster, which means more damage coming in. It's not as valuable for us as warriors because it doesn't do much for our threat generation (it does more with the 3.2 changes), and many of our attacks aren't even parriable, but it's still going to reduce the chance to be parried by a boss and therefore reduce your incoming damage. The glyph of SoV is equivalent to 10 expertice skill, not just rating but SKILL. That is simply a huge amount of expertice you don't have to try to get from gear, for the small price of dropping a marginally useful AOE tanking glyph. If warriors had a glyph they could throw in that would give them 10 expertice skill all the time, I guarantee every prot warrior would be using it.

The OP is significantly under the hit cap, the RD glyph adds 8% hit to RD and now Hand of Reckoning. There are many fights in the game where missed taunts can lead to player deaths, why chance it.

Glyphed hand of salvation is a 20% damage reduction on a 2 min CD, with a penalty of 20% threat loss. I've found many situations where I'm far ahead on threat, and an extra 20% DR can help give some breathing room. A good example is council hard mode, killing steelbreaker last. I'm tanking him from the beginning, but he's the last kill target. It's a long fight so I can use the DR from the glyph several times and I'll still be miles ahead on threat by the time it's his turn to die.

Darth, didn't I already advise you to pick up a second point in improved judgements? You're not able to do a proper rotation without it. Also, unless you're going to be tanking general vezax anytime soon, the second point in SA shouldn't be necessary, use it to fill out redoubt. Icreased block value, even if it is a proc, is damage mitigated.

08-04-2009, 02:16 PM
interesting insight on the salvation, and i didnt know the expertise was skill, i thought it was rating. Ya i was gonna get rid of one of my SAs but figured i'd wait til after that patch to see how things play out, prolly gonna respec anyway.

With the judgement CD as it is, I havent been having any tank troubles, waiting one second before casting judgment every time seemed like a decent trade off for +1% dmg, I know the 1 second every rotation can add up, but i am not really having any problems with my rotation, I think the systematic spells of the rotation are more of a theoretical plan, then actually necessary. I basically just prioritize my spells and use w/e is up, changing based on the circumstances. I have use the 'proper' rotation before, and I really haven't done any worse while doing more of a FCFS type thing,
I figured i'd just save the talent.

In defense of HotR, it is very helpful for multi target pick ups [lots of time trash] and is very helpful on Emalon, especially when you lag like shit in 25 mans hehe.

08-04-2009, 06:09 PM
To the OP. First off if you plan to tank seriously get rid of both herbalism and skinning. Get mining for +50 stamina (now more with the new patch) and blackmithing/jewelcrafting/enchanting. (You could probably keep herbalism if you get alchemy or inscription but the viablity of tankadins with such professions is somewhat arguable). If you're planning to DPS then any combination of blacksmithin/jewelcrafting/enchanting.
Then the gems ... +16 dodge gem?!? And you're worried you're below 26K HP?!? Red gems should always be dodge/stamina purples. Yellow should be either defense/stamina greens or pure defense yellows. No excuses. Get at least some Dalaran rep for the gauntlets (there are nice new ones in the Trial of the Champion so get a group and run it repeatedly). The head meta should be the Austere Earthsiege Diamond (+31 stamina and +3% armor). Oh and get rid of the Repelling Charge. If you get too used to build defense values around it you will endup pretty dry.

08-04-2009, 08:19 PM
Thank you for the help with the spec, it's hard to track down a decent pally tank spec without knowing any pally tank I trust enough to ask. I did a fair amount of searching last night on the 9696 and wondered honestly why i didn't see this myself. Many of the problems posted here I've fixed and while hope can wish for the armory to update in a decent and current fashion it looks as though it's being stubborn. I will put all the changes to good use and repost my character when my armory update appropriately

08-05-2009, 09:21 AM
meh, defense is defense, as long as its always active it doesnt matter how you get it,
til he gets a better trinket from ulduar or something, the Repelling Charge works fine.

Also, definitley go JC not BS for your second proff, the Dragon's Eye gems are much better than the 2 sockets, if iwere you i would do BS as well, and not have any gathering professions however.

There are probably upgrades that drop in the normal version of the new 5 man, and for sure ones in the heroic [it drops 25 man anxx equivilent loot i beleive]. You can tank
it NP with your gear.

08-11-2009, 04:36 AM
The dragon eye gems give equal bonus to the extra sockets. Repelling Charge is as bad as Essence of Gossamer is - you have more valuable trinkets but there is no damn way you can remove it.

08-17-2009, 08:19 AM
actually, right now the top normal stam gem is 30 stamina.
put that in 2 sockets and you get 60 stamina.
dragon's eyes are worth 51 stamina, replace 3 30 stamina gems with 51 stamina gems
and you get a net increase of 63 stamina. So they aren't equal.

But you can get around this argument by simply having both, like me =)

And you can remove repelling charge, you just have to regem a little bit, you should have a fairly big defense cushion with it on anyway, as long as you keep the enchants that are worth the most.

08-21-2009, 02:43 AM
Ooh stunning 3 stam difference is sure OP :P

08-21-2009, 06:52 AM
hey, every little bit counts ;)
got duel spec? NOW jc is op

08-21-2009, 11:29 AM
When i leveled up through as prot I worked up maxx mining and bs. As soon as I farmed up enough items i dropped mining to quickly power leveled JC 1-450. I've seen that it is definately nice. Even if you are not gemming for stam, you can still achieve the huge dodge or whatever it is. As far as I can tell it gives us the upper hand.

08-21-2009, 11:54 AM
not to mention they make way more money than gathering professions ever could,
or they used to, 3.2 killed my BS money making =/