PDA

View Full Version : Pally Tank Gear/Hard Modes, am I ready?



Quinnly
08-02-2009, 10:40 PM
So I just joined a new guild and they want me to tank both 10 man, and 25 man hard modes. Now from what I have come to understand paladin main tanks are a bit lack luster, and Im trying to get some advice on if my gear is even good enough for hard modes such as XT and Vezax.

Im currently sitting at 32k Hp/21.29% Dodge/17.88% Parry/19.55% Block
unbuffed, and I am about to make both my Spiked Deathdealers and the 226 equivilent belt.

Advice please


Also, what weapon enchant should I go with now that I have too much hit rating?

Thanks very much

Zivh
08-02-2009, 10:47 PM
Link your armory please :)

DeviousOne
08-02-2009, 10:50 PM
Our paladin tank (main tank, and actually, the only tank left in our guild since the other two quit last week) has tanked most, if not all hard modes in Ulduar 10/25.

Quinnly
08-02-2009, 10:51 PM
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Ner'zhul&n=quinnly)

my apologies

My gear is nothing special, two weeks in naxx 25 and the only thing I have gotten was the Maly key heh

be honest though

Also should I make the belt or boots first in your opinion

DeviousOne
08-02-2009, 11:00 PM
Probably need a few 25man ulduar drops before you are hard mode ready. T8 atleast.

Umm. A new shield as well. Get the belt.

Zivh
08-02-2009, 11:00 PM
Your gear is decent. I cannot comment on the spec because I do not play a pally.

Hard modes are pretty tough. You may want to get a few runs through 25m regular and 10m HM and get some new gear.

I would recommend the belt over the boots as your belt is still a Heroic piece.

EDIT: Weapon enchant would be Blade Ward most likely, maybe Blood Draining.

DeviousOne
08-02-2009, 11:02 PM
Blade Warding has been proven via testing to be pretty crappy. I'd stick with Mongoose/Accuracy.

Quinnly
08-02-2009, 11:03 PM
Thanks for the input, I tanked thorim hard mode alone for 30% with lackluster dps, So thats why I wasnt sure if I would be ready or not.

Anything else is appreciated

Zivh
08-02-2009, 11:04 PM
@Devious

Hmm....I hadn't heard that, everywhere I've seen people love it, do you have a link to an article about it that you are citing? I am mostly just curious for myself :)

Quinnly
08-02-2009, 11:17 PM
im interested in it as well, i just bought all the mats for it >.>

DeviousOne
08-02-2009, 11:21 PM
I've read a few articles here and there. The proc rate is pretty low, and the uptime is around 28-30%, which is also inferior to Mongoose, which still provides like 2% dodge.

Zivh
08-02-2009, 11:30 PM
Source: WoWHead.com's Comments section, post by Illuminat Formula: Enchant Weapon - Blade Ward - Item - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=46027#comments)


There has been far to much missunderstanding and missinformation about this enchant.

1. Where does it drop?
A. It drops from all the ulduar25 bosses.
It will also drop of Hardmodes like FL 2 towers or more. (own experiance and LusoChampion's post).
i suggest all guilds to do FL+2 towers (frost and storms are easy).

2. Does it stack?
A. On a prot paladin and prot warrior in our guild single wielding this enchant it stacked 3 times.
So that means that it has no internal Cooldown OR it is extremely low.
I am yet to find a deathknight that wanna try and dualwield this to see if it will stack more.
But 3 stacks is 600 parry rating and 1800-2400 damage on next parry.
(Reportings of 5 stacks for 1000 parry rating and up to 4000 damage)
Confirmed i had 5 stacks. Any screenshots of more stacks would be lovely

3. Can the damaging part CRIT?
A. Yes it can critical strike. It has critted quite alot for me since i sometimes boost with half retri half prot gear and having 50% crit does help my chances ;).

4. How long does it last?
A. The first proc lasts 10 seconds. If it procs again it refreshes the timer to 10 seconds again.
So in reality you can be lucky and having a new proc every 9 second and thus having 100% uptime.
BUT that is pure theory and wont happen. :).
But i had it proc twice at 1 second left so i had it for 28 seconds in a row more then once.

5. Is this a good enchant to get?
A. Well this IS the best avoidance enchant in the game.
And since it also does some damage it does help with threat a bit aswell.
In a full Halls of Stone heroic i did some testing in then it procced 30 times and did 1% of my total damage.
my average dps was 2400 (as protection).
1% dps is still a bit of help on threat. and it certainly is a awsome avoidance enchant.
Any maintank should get this.
Leave the healing for the healers.
If you require the lifeblood enchant as a tank then your guild might need to work a bit on your healers.

Who should get this enchant? (Tanks only)
Warrior=Defenetly
Paladin=Defenetly (Absolutly not the blood draining enchant due to prot pally having ardent defender at 35%!)
Druid=Absolutly NOT
Deathknight=Tricky. i am unsure if dualwielding this enchant will surpass the usefullness of the 4% rune they have.
Any well experianced Deathknight who is willing to dualwield this and tell its proc uptime and parry compared to the static rune.
Please say so :).

DeviousOne
08-02-2009, 11:32 PM
I tend to not take Wowhead comments as literal truth. I've read actual posts/articles where testing was done. I'm sorry, I can't find them at the moment, but I'm sure this site or elitistjerks have it up. Its simply a mediocre enchant for it's costs.

Zivh
08-02-2009, 11:35 PM
I wouldn't call it literal truth, but he has broken down the basics of the enchant here, which is just some nice info. Most of this game is personal preference along with recommendations and experience, I'm just not so hasty to call this a worthless enchant. Our main tank (also the highest geared character on the server) uses this enchant and loves it.

DeviousOne
08-02-2009, 11:38 PM
I usually find that gear and knowledge of the game have little to do with each other (unless we're talking actual hard hard modes).

Not insulting your tank or anything, but he should look closer at the enchant procs and damage uptime over the course of a weeks worth of testing and see if it's worth it.

Zivh
08-02-2009, 11:45 PM
You have a valid point. I am quite curious myself to see the uptimes and the actual number of procs over the course of a Uld 25 clear.

I just don't think anyone should be so quick to disregard an epic enchant out of the highest level dungeon in the game, especially when it is really one of the ONLY true tanking enchants, and definitely the best avoidance enchant.

In all honesty...most tanks don't really need 25 hit and crit once they're in 25m Ulduar. I would think something that has a chance to add a bit more threat and some pretty substantial avoidance values may end up paying off more in the long run, even if its subtle.

DeviousOne
08-02-2009, 11:56 PM
Mongoose is an avoidance enchant. 2% dodge is nothing to sneer at. Just because something is epic doesn't mean its good.

Quinnly
08-03-2009, 12:08 AM
Thanks for the input, for a tank is mongoose uptime still pretty much a solid 100%?

Zivh
08-03-2009, 12:39 AM
200 Parry rating gives a level 80 player a 4.07% parry chance before diminishing returns. Diminishing returns on that 200 rating alone will bring it down to 3.9%. That is with only one stack. 5 stacks would put this at ~ 19.54% parry chance. The DR may affect it further at 1000 Parry rating however even if it was 80% of that it would end up a better choice.

Reading a few logs...the damage comes out to about 1% of the tank's overall damage caused.

Mongoose is decent, but its outdated for level 80. I would say this enchant would be better from a min/max standpoint. Some people may not want to spend the gold to get it but with 200k+ gold in an established raiding guild's bank, it is completely trivial to equate gold value with enchant value.

This is a lot of theorycrafting, and this conversation should probably migrate to that forum for further insight and examination.

In summation, I would suggest Blade Ward over Mongoose if you want are aiming for min/maxing. If you are short on gold go with Mongoose as Devious suggests and you will most likely do just fine. Or, re-roll a DK and never worry about weapon enchants again ^^

EDIT: Mongoose is not 100% uptime, you get approximate 1.4 Procs per minute with Mongoose, equating to roughly 23 seconds per minute.

DeviousOne
08-03-2009, 12:48 AM
You barely ever hit 5 stacks, or even like, 3 stacks, with Blade Warding, from what I hear.

Zivh
08-03-2009, 12:59 AM
The point was that even at one stack it is more avoidance. More stacks just increases the "effectiveness gap" between Blade Ward and Mongoose.

Quinnly
08-03-2009, 01:20 AM
I am now currently sitting at 32494 hp 20.86% dodge 18.42% parry 19.55% block with my belt. Whats the general hp/dodge/parry/block of any other pally tanks that happen to be reading this forum, preferably ones with better gear than me.

Specpally
08-03-2009, 08:16 AM
I am now currently sitting at 32494 hp 20.86% dodge 18.42% parry 19.55% block with my belt. Whats the general hp/dodge/parry/block of any other pally tanks that happen to be reading this forum, preferably ones with better gear than me.
I'm sitting at 31.9k hp with 22.6% dodge, 20.18% parry and 19.68% block with 558 defense. I haven't raided in a little over 2 months...

Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Durotan&n=Specpally)

Necrobat
08-04-2009, 07:43 AM
Blade Ward isn't great for a pally, nor is Mongoose really, purely for the fact it's a chance on hit proc. A pally doesn't hit as often with their weapon to actually chance a proc. I still use +26 Agil for a straight up .5% dodge boost.

When my Armory finally decides to update, 30.5k unbuffed/25% dodge/18% parry/24% block (in standard tank kit, not my dodge set) pally tank here.
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Caelestrasz&n=Vaida)