Darksend

05-21-2009, 11:40 AM

Saw this this morning (obviously from a druid but the theory of it applies to everyone) and was wondering about it, for some reason this seems completely off to me but I know nothing about the topic:

Ok.. I can't seem to post on the druid forums this morning, but after the third post I've seen there recently about weapon procs and haste being good for that, I'd really love it if someone were willing to collect a lot of data on weapon proc chance at different levels of haste. Here's the problem.. if we go by the accepted Burning Crusade mechanics for weapon procs, they don't scale with haste, period. In fact, they anti-scale with haste. Yes, we have confirmation that Omen of Clarity was changed to a flat percentage (5.833333%) chance on hit to proc to allow it to scale with haste, but I've never seen any documented evidence that weapon procs were adjusted similarly. Here's the current understanding of how the PPM system works:

The enchant has a base 'proc-per-minute' value. For nearly all weapon enchants, this value is 1.00, or one proc-per-minute.

We then determine our chance on hit proc percentage, based on our *current* white attack speed (i.e. base speed + haste). So if we have a 1.00 attack speed, it should take us 60 white attacks to get a proc, or a 1.666666% chance on hit to proc. We of course will see more than one proc-per-minute on average because yellow attacks have this same 1.666666% chance on hit to proc, although missed attacks will reduce our proc rate slightly too.

Now we add say 10% haste..

1 / (1 + 0.1) = 0.90909091 attack speed. To get one white attack proc-per-minute with a 0.90909091 attack speed, it would now require a chance on hit of:

60 / 0.90909091 = 66 attacks required, or:

0.90909091 / 66 = 1.37741% chance on hit to proc. By adding 10% haste, we still have the same white attack procs per minute, but we've effectively reduced our yellow attack procs per minute (because the frequency of those is nearly (haste increases Omen of Clarity procs, which increase energy regen rate, meaning more yellow attacks too) unchanged by the 10% haste).

Thus the Berserking enchant actually averages as its highest uptime without any haste at all, and typically drops below Massacre in relative value the moment you add in Windfury.

But is this correct? I'd really like to find out if there's been a change to the PPM mechanics as of patch 3.0.

posting this here instead of the DPS forum because I am assuming that blade warding and mongoose are PPM as well

Ok.. I can't seem to post on the druid forums this morning, but after the third post I've seen there recently about weapon procs and haste being good for that, I'd really love it if someone were willing to collect a lot of data on weapon proc chance at different levels of haste. Here's the problem.. if we go by the accepted Burning Crusade mechanics for weapon procs, they don't scale with haste, period. In fact, they anti-scale with haste. Yes, we have confirmation that Omen of Clarity was changed to a flat percentage (5.833333%) chance on hit to proc to allow it to scale with haste, but I've never seen any documented evidence that weapon procs were adjusted similarly. Here's the current understanding of how the PPM system works:

The enchant has a base 'proc-per-minute' value. For nearly all weapon enchants, this value is 1.00, or one proc-per-minute.

We then determine our chance on hit proc percentage, based on our *current* white attack speed (i.e. base speed + haste). So if we have a 1.00 attack speed, it should take us 60 white attacks to get a proc, or a 1.666666% chance on hit to proc. We of course will see more than one proc-per-minute on average because yellow attacks have this same 1.666666% chance on hit to proc, although missed attacks will reduce our proc rate slightly too.

Now we add say 10% haste..

1 / (1 + 0.1) = 0.90909091 attack speed. To get one white attack proc-per-minute with a 0.90909091 attack speed, it would now require a chance on hit of:

60 / 0.90909091 = 66 attacks required, or:

0.90909091 / 66 = 1.37741% chance on hit to proc. By adding 10% haste, we still have the same white attack procs per minute, but we've effectively reduced our yellow attack procs per minute (because the frequency of those is nearly (haste increases Omen of Clarity procs, which increase energy regen rate, meaning more yellow attacks too) unchanged by the 10% haste).

Thus the Berserking enchant actually averages as its highest uptime without any haste at all, and typically drops below Massacre in relative value the moment you add in Windfury.

But is this correct? I'd really like to find out if there's been a change to the PPM mechanics as of patch 3.0.

posting this here instead of the DPS forum because I am assuming that blade warding and mongoose are PPM as well