05-06-2009, 08:41 PM
Recently My guild has been having NPC's going taunt immune. mainly this is because of over taunting (recorded 9 taunts on one mob in 3 secs). I have looked for the rules of taunt how it works mechanically and how DR plays in roll. if Anyone has a link or knows the information after the change I will be very grateful if toss me the information. Thanks in advance.
05-07-2009, 03:35 AM
It's due to diminishing returns, and its arsed up alot of content which requires tank swapovers, or mob/boss position redirects. Certainly an answer to any overaggroing as a mob legs it, 3 tanks taunt it before someone says 'I've got it' and it goes immune and a dps goes squish, then half a raid before someone can get a stable taunt in.
We started having issues on Mimiron with him swapping between tanks too early, so the basic solution was to ban people from using taunt until specifically told otherwise. Draconian but it has cut down on some of the immune moments, and DPS had a firm warning to get finger off trigger, to assist.
The basic issue is that they nerfed the ability to prevent boss ping pong - see Cider's Sarth video as an alternative. Flipside is it has critically effected normal content requiring swapovers (such as adds going to Thorim, 4H, mimiron etc.) One of our tanks bandied around a figure of 15 seconds, not 100% sure if that's the time allowed between taunts (seems long for me) or the time of immunity which makes more sense to me, but I could be missing some numbers.
The result is if you do a taunt and it fails, then a mocking blow then the MB may cause immunity. Or if there is an issue with both you could be royally fooked and the mob goes immune. The second issue is mobs failing to react to a taunt without an error message, leading to the above taunt spam and mob immunity. I have seem mobs fail to react during a cast (locked onto XXX target), and yet at other times everything has functioned flawlessly.
I can see the logic, given it being an exploit if interpreted that way rather than a use of current in game mechanics, but given the complications seen in various threads of guilds wiping suddenly on 4H, tanks dying as no-one can get an add off them and swap a debuff over I really do wonder wtf they were playing at, an an extra 2-3 repair bills per night, plus food and misc crap doesn't enhance my gaming experience, or that of other tanks or raid members dead as a result. I'd rather have just seen a time delay on a mob/boss being effected by a taunt, rather than:- taunted, did it work, hmm, err, hang on try again, oh fook immune, routine we have at the moment.
Bottom line is more taunts = bad, you have to try and make sure the one you do get in counts, multiple taunts in a short span will just immune a mob. +hit gear/food is an obvious answer, but most dencently kitted tanks will have that anyway on T7/8 content on trash, easily for naxx, and still have a respectable amount even T8 survival specced. What I would look at is raid discipline, and tank discipline & communication around taunts to minimise tank doubling ups or unneccessary taunt repeats.
05-07-2009, 05:39 AM
Very nicely said, Dun.
We were lamenting this in our 25s this week. In many fights we have 3 tanks who are supremely on the ball when adds break loose or join the fight, or when someone pulls threat on something. This has been bad since in the past there were no repercussions if all three tanks taunted instantly, since it would land on one and you'd be fine if things didn't settle immediately. Now when things don't or even when they do, the appropriate tank can't taunt the target back. We had an add go loose on Ignis because the two tanks were both trying to pick it up, and the target switching made them think it was about to pick up on a healer.
I, too, understand why they did this, but I think it's really going to be a matter of tanks tightening their responses and fostering more trust in their tank team that the appropriate person will do what is necessary. That said, it may be a little bit extreme at the moment, and maybe could use a little toning down.