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Frankenkrist
04-08-2009, 01:02 PM
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050000000000000000000000000305050303 5203310030120131351035202000100000000000000000000&glyph=072414040602&version=9757 (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050000000000000000000000000305050303 5203310030120131351035202000100000000000000000000&glyph=072414040602&version=9757)

This is what I plan on using for 3.1. Glyph of Howling Blast just seems to useful to pass up if you're full Frost. Does anyone know just how useful Glyph of Dark Command is? Does non-glyphed talent fail often enough for it to be a useful major glyph? Was also considering Glyph of Anti-Magic Shell, but the extra 2 seconds just seem to match up with the other major glyphs.

Comments and advice appreciated.

VerticalEvent
04-09-2009, 03:01 AM
I think this might work a little better
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050403 4003300030025101351025030000000000000000000000000&glyph=072416040602&version=9757

If your going to glyph HB, why bother with Epidemic? You should be casting HB every 8 seconds, so Frost Fever should be constantly up on all targets.

From my understanding, Killing Machine rank 4 and rank 5 are not that different, so you can save a point by not maxxing it.

Hungering Cold, is still not that useful. If your spamming HB as often as you can (which, as Frost, you should be), the Frost Fever application is of no use, and you'll break Hungering Cold every cast.

Max out Blood of the North. Increase in Frost Damage and turning Blood runes into Death Runes is going to help in getting more Obliterates in. Acclimation is not that useful, from my experience, and might only be worthwhile as a second spec of magic bosses.

I like Improved Icy Talons, and would recommend taking 2 points out of Virulence and finishing that portion of the tree instead.

Frankenkrist
04-09-2009, 10:34 AM
Adjusted build with 5 points to spend:
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050000000000000000000000000305050103 4203310030025131351005002000000000000000000000000&glyph=140000040605&version=9757 (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050000000000000000000000000305050103 4203310030025131351005002000000000000000000000000&glyph=140000040605&version=9757)


Good point on the Epidemic talent, I hadn't thought of that. I currently use Hungering Cold mostly to apply frost fever, so dropping it frees up another point.

I think Deathchill is too useful to pass up for only 1 talent point. Deathchill + Howling Blast is great initial agro on larger groups of mobs.

I also find the 2 points in Chill of the Grave useful, especially when I'm looking for runic power in a hurry for Anti-magic shield, Icebound Fortitude or ghoul sacrifice. Plus it makes Frost Strike almost constantly available when all runes are on CD.

Acclimation also seems useful to me. Seems to proc often enough that I rarely find magic dmg to be a problem for me.

This build has 5 points left unspent. Most likely I would spend them in Bladed Armor, Icy Talons (seems to match well with points spent in Killing Machine), or Virulence (maybe more helpful for higher-end raiding).

For the 2 open major glyphs, I am undecided between Dark Command, Icebound Fortitude and Unbreakable Armor.

Oroborous
04-09-2009, 10:56 AM
Don't waste points in icy talons, chances are a shaman will be raiding with you and WF will overide it, my suggestion is to take points out of that and chill of the grave, from there put it into finishing KM and Icy reach is really nice if you can get it due to opening threat when pulling.

VerticalEvent
04-09-2009, 12:28 PM
I'm not a fan of Icy Reach - it only has any real use for tanking at the start of a pull, and casting it earlier, could make positioning the boss harder (he runs at you, pass the tanking area, now you need to position him).

If you ask me, put three of those points into Ravenous Dead, and get the 3% bonus to strength. This should help you with threat generation (+AP) and avoidance (+parry) (not by much, but it should help).

That leaves two points left over, so you can put it into Morbidity (faster DnD in case of agroing patrols) or Virulence, for higher hit ratings. Of course, you can put two into Bladed Armor (as, from my understanding, 1 point in Bladed Armor is better then 1 point in 2-Handed Weapon Specialization).

For glyphs, I would go with Unbreakable Armor and Icebound Fortitude, as these should help you tank better. I rarely see Dark Command fail, unless the boss is immune (ie. Sapphirion) and, if you take Virulence, it should hit 99% of the time.

Frankenkrist
04-09-2009, 01:04 PM
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050000000000000000000000000305050003 5203310030025131351025002300000000000000000000000&glyph=141624040605&version=9757 (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050000000000000000000000000305050003 5203310030025131351025002300000000000000000000000&glyph=141624040605&version=9757)

I like this as a final build. I agree with moving the 1 point from Icy Talons to finish maxing Killing Machine. I run with 5 points in KM now and it procs fairly often. The 2 points in Chill of the Grave seem more useful to me than Icy Reach. It's what I currently use, and I almost never have to wait for runic power for my mitigation talents.

I went with 3 points in Ravenous Dead and 2 in Virulence for the final 5. The 3% strength plus ghoul buff seem to make RD better than Bladed Armor.

I agree with the final two glyph choices too. Does anyone know the math for what defense level will guarantee 30% damage reduction from Icebound Fortitude? At that point it would become a useless glyph, but I'm sure that would require near top-end gear to reach.

Griefknight
04-09-2009, 01:34 PM
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050003 5203310230025101351005030000000000000000000000000&glyph=141624040605&version=9757

This is pretty much what your build should look like for 3.1, you should also be using Frost Strike, Obliterate, Icy Touch, Howling Blast, or Death and Decay glyphs (take the 3 you need/want).

Unholy Command = Bad talent

You almost always want at least 4/5 Bladed Armor but 5/5 is best. Morbidity is one of your best talents and any tank should take it. You never want Epidemic in a Frost build because the single-target rotation doesn't require it and with the added duration to diseases in 3.1 it makes it even more worthless for Frost. Virulence is pretty useless for Frost since most of your attacks will be unaffected. Ravenous Dead is an OK talent but its no where near better then Bladed Armor and the ghoul 'buff' is weak for a nonDPS spec.

The IBF Glyph is a PvP glyph you should have at least 30% just for being at 540 defense. I personally never use Glyph of Dark Command because I rarely (if ever) have to taunt in a raid. I'm not 100% sure what glyphs I'll be using but I think I'll be going with FS, OB, and UA.

Cornix
04-09-2009, 07:38 PM
Never EVER take your points out of Chill of the Grave. EVER.
Frost Strike can and WILL be almost 30% of your damage, and it will do more damage than your Obliterate at times. Not only that but Rune Strike costs RP as well, so splitting between the two is difficult in any case, even with BoSanc. More RP means more threat, less GCDs wasted and more damage you're putting out for your raid. Not to mention that the runic power gains you get from Chill of the Grave generates threat in of itself.

Griefknight
04-09-2009, 10:59 PM
I may have been wrong about the Glyph of IBF, it may actually give you 30% base and then add the extra % from Defense.

Konfusion
04-09-2009, 11:12 PM
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055320000000000000000000000325050010 5203310030025101351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=142012060504&version=9704


set bonus 3.1= more emphasis n rune strike spamming your going to need more RP to spam them more, second tier blood second thing( computers messed up atm cant see the name of it)

also second tier of blood 3rd icon 4% increased damage x206=8.something % increased threat from runestrikes /frost/plague strike/ any available auto attacks.

I dont think I speced into frost /improved frost tallens should have an enhance shammy or a frost dps dk in the raid. other than that I dont really remember aythig specificly different about my spec from your other than most of my points are filled in , and most of you specs are really wack and have points just kinda thrown in in many different places... maby im wrong but im sure that im one of the better dk tanks around..

Frankenkrist
04-10-2009, 01:02 PM
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055001000000000000000000000305050003 5203310030125131351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=241417040605&version=9757 (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055001000000000000000000000305050003 5203310030125131351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=241417040605&version=9757)

This is the latest build I've come up with. After working the 5 points into Bladed Armor, I went 1 more into Blood for Rune Tap just as an extra safety button. Most people seem to dislike Acclimation, but it has been too useful for me to pass up. I also kept 1 point in Hungering Cold for this build. It has saved me several times having some CC ability when 2 or 3 group members go down. I'm then able to freeze mobs and kill them 1 at a time.

I'd like to have Morbidity, but just can't find where I would take the 3 points. I generally only use Death and Decay to begin a pull anyway. Howling Blast seems to hold agro well enough after that for larger pulls. In my experience, if I needed another DnD laid down, I was usually waiting for runes, not the talent CD.

Griefknight
04-10-2009, 02:18 PM
You most likely won't ever use Hungering Cold. You most likely won't ever use Rune Tap. You most likely won't ever use Acclimation. All three talents are pretty much useless except for situations you rarely encounter. I'd go with 3 points in Scent of Blood and 2 points in Morbidity.

VerticalEvent
04-10-2009, 09:08 PM
Acclimation isn't that bad of a choice. It is passive, and it does reduce damage, which does make it a good tanking ability, especially with Uldar coming out soon - it could be a life saver in some encounters that we do not know about. As well, with Rune Tap, with it's 30 second cooldown, it's probably not worth taking, as it doesn't heal for all that much.

I'd Drop a point in Deathchill (DnD + Icytoch + Pestilence + Blood Tap + HB should be enough to grap agro on trash) and Rune Tap, and put both points into Morbidity.

Steewe
04-11-2009, 08:40 AM
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050000000000000000000000000305050103 4203310030025131351005002000000000000000000000000&glyph=140000040605&version=9757#

I honestly think this is better but mmo hasnt updated their talents to match the games.... so to me this still isnt even the best...

VerticalEvent
04-11-2009, 08:59 AM
TO STewies build:
To me, if you are going to take Chill of the Grave - you might as well take Runic Mastery to keep yourself from hitting the Runic cap as much as possible. As well, no point to put any point into Icy Talons, unless your going to go all the way with it.

I'm not a fan of Deathchill, since it's only good for initial agro and I find my HB crits often enough as is. I would prefer to put that talent point into something to sustain threat in the long run.

The points into Deathgrip I see as going into Morbidity, depending on your style. I prefer Morbidity on the basis of grabbing agro from patrols that might randomly come by, and use Dark Command instead of Death grip, if DG is on CD.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050000000000000000000000000325050003 4203300030025131351005020000000000000000000000000&glyph=140000040605&version=9757

This still leaves 5 points unused, which you can put into either Bladed Armor (more threat) or Ravenous Dead + Deathrgip/Morbidity (a little less threat, but a slight increase in avoidance due to strength = parry).

As a side note, I'd prefer if Rime functioned like Sudden Doom, and cast a HB on your Obliterate Target, instead of refreshing HB and no rune casting.

Steewe
04-11-2009, 09:11 AM
The only thing is when you put 5 points into blood of the north and use your bloodstrike and turn it into a death rune i dont think it will give you the parrying percentage amount.... and theres no need to get anniahlation if your using death strike instead of obliterate.... and i get the endless winter to make mind freeze consume no rune power so i dont have to worry about it...plus getting the unholy comman really is no need at all if you get icy reach and i grab epidemic so i dont have to worry so much on casting icy touch and plague strike so much

Steewe
04-11-2009, 09:15 AM
[http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/deathknight/talents.html?tal=205020000000000000000000000325250 51030321101212001313500352000000000000000000000000 00


heres a better talent plave for what we're talking about cause its up to date you have to go down to the bottom of the page where the numbers are and highligh those and copy it over to your quote...

Steewe
04-11-2009, 09:16 AM
errrr nvm that didnt work :(

VerticalEvent
04-11-2009, 09:35 AM
On Blade Barrier: Even if the blood runes are Death Runes, when you use the Death Runes, they still count as Blood Runes for Blade Barrier, so you still get the extra parry/damage reduction as well as an extra Oblitertae.

Why are you using Death Strike if your Frost Tanking? There's lots of talents in Frost that improve Obliterate total damage, and the healing gained from Death Strike isn't worth much, unless you talent it up (Blood tree).

I think something is up with the link, since I didn't take any points into Endless Winter.

Icy Reach, to me, only helps in the first pull. I think Unholy Command is better, since, not only does it make the mob target you, it also repositions it to be in the crowd, where you can AoE it with the rest if them, which is good for casters who are on the loose.

As stated earlier, Epidimic is useless to Frost Tanks in 3.1, with HB now applying Frost Fever (Glyph) and the diseases being given a longer life time.

From reading WoWhead's comments, 5/5 Killing Machine procs 5 times a minute (12s), which makes me believe 4/5 procs 4 times a minute (15s), for the sake of an extra 3 second between procs, I'll place an extra talent point else where.

Here's my old talent build from an earlier comment with the latest mmo talent calculator:
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050000000000000000000000000325050003 4203300030025131351005020000000000000000000000000&glyph=140000040601&version=9767

Steewe
04-11-2009, 09:53 AM
well you'll still need lichborn for the extra 25% chance for enemies to miss you and you'll need butchery and scent of blood in the blood tree to help gain more rune power to cast frost strike more often especially since it cant be dodged blocked or parried

VerticalEvent
04-11-2009, 02:18 PM
Ah.

Well, there's been some changes in 3.1, Steewe. I guess Blizzard thought it was unbalanced that Frost would have two tanking CDs, and Lichborne no longer increases chance to be missed - keeps the immune and breakage of some debuffs, but it no longer helps us avoid damage.

And, from my expierence as a Frost Tank, I usually have just enough Runic Power to keep my RP skills up and running; that Chill of the Grave is going to generate more then enough Runic Power for me.

Satorri
04-12-2009, 06:13 AM
I guarantee Lichborne was changed as a PvP balance, not as a tanking CD. Really as a tanking CD it's lackluster. Miss isn't much help to our mechanics, so it was a nice life saver for 15 sec but on a very long 3 min CD. I won't miss it, I never really used it, heh.

VerticalEvent
04-12-2009, 06:21 AM
Meh, I find it nice on Patchwerk, where I had tanking buff for the first 2 minutes almost constantly.

Frankenkrist
04-13-2009, 02:51 PM
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050003 4203300230025131351005020000000000000000000000000&glyph=241417040605&version=9757 (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050003 4203300230025131351005020000000000000000000000000&glyph=241417040605&version=9757)

This build has no points wasted on talents with CDs, except for Unbreakable Armor, a must for tanking. Only 2 points in Morbidity, but I can't pass up Acclimation, and it's not worth taking unless maxxed. Between Chill of the Grave and Glyph of Icy Touch, it has plenty of RP generation.

The only 2 points I can see moving would possibly be Merciless Combat, but they could only be moved to talents before it in the Frost tree.

Morgantis
04-14-2009, 05:02 AM
I am thinking of going with this spec
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050403 4003300030025101351025030000000000000000000000000&glyph=132411040605&version=9757 (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050403 4003300030025101351025030000000000000000000000000&glyph=132411040605&version=9757)
I tested it on the PTR and it feels the most natural in my perspective
Please some reactions on this

Bryenne
04-14-2009, 05:38 AM
I still don't see why many frost tanks bother putting points in Morbitity. Really. DnD is practically worthless for a frost build, HB+BB is going to net you more threat for the same amount of runes, and allow you to put those 3 points into something useful. Pick up Virulence only if you're low on spell hit, otherwise you should drop it and plow those points back into the frost tree.

10/56/5 (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050503 4203301030125101351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=142415060504&version=9767)
No nonsense, all purpose 2H frost tank build. Heroics, 10-mans, 25's, whatever. Good for main tanking, great for offtanking, superior for aoe tanking. Sure, you could float the point in Hungering Cold to something else, and swap out the 3rd major glyph for, say, Disease. Or Rune Strike, or Frost Strike, or Obliterate. Pick your favorite, the first two are the real essentials. I LIKE Hungering Cold, it's great for grabbing unfortunate patrols, interrupting casts, and stopping (or at least delaying) your casters from getting squished. Pick up gear with solid defense, gem for hit rating and strength. Don't feel like or can't affodr dual-speccing? Get some dps gear, switch to blood presence, and this build puts out respectable damage when not tanking (more than a prot warrior or paladin, to be sure).

Now get out there and tank.

Malvat
04-14-2009, 05:38 AM
try this one on for size
[/URL][URL]http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050003 5203310030025101351005032000000000000000000000000&glyph=122414010405&version=9757 (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050403 4003300030025101351025030000000000000000000000000&glyph=132411040605&version=9757#)

Malvat
04-14-2009, 05:44 AM
to Bryenne ...
i will only speak for myself. tho others my think along the same lines. ... i use DnD on most group pulls, and like to have it up when possible. Now i have some trouble thinking outside the box on occasions so i'm glad you suggested an alternate strat for not using DnD. i will have to try the HB+BB especially now that HB infects targets with frost fever ... going back to rebuild!!

VerticalEvent
04-14-2009, 06:47 AM
I only like having DnD on CD for patrolls, while my HB is on Cooldown. Rather then wait 8 seconds before I'll be able to agro them, I'll toss a DnD on them, which, hopefully, should be off the CD from when I pulled the inital group.

As for Hungering Cold, I run with a group that love to AoE, so Hungering cold would break almost the instant I cast it. As well, I'd breake it with my own AoE, so it kinda loses it's appeal. Maybe, in Ulduar, I'll pick it up, depending on how the instance goes.

Mallvat: I would say pick either Morbidity or Unholy Command, but not both.

For anyone going for a high Runic generation build, I'm going to say Runic Matery is going to be a must, to make sure you can hold all that extra RP you will be generating (and, when Rime procs).

This is probably the build I'll be MTing, which should prep me for the unknown.
http://talent.mmo-champion.comhttp://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000325050003 4203300030025121351005030000000000000000000000000&glyph=162414060405&version=9757

Tankkin
04-14-2009, 08:11 AM
I have a similar approach to dnd to VerticalEvent + the high threat dps in my guild rush in before dnd's ticks have generated enough threat to keep creeps on me while my runes refresh.
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055020000000000000000000000305250503 0203311000025131351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=000000000000&version=9767
This is the closest to my current build i've been comfortably able to get.

However, depending on what the dk dps spec into i might be able to drop improved icy talons. If that's the case then here's my build
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055020000000000000000000000305250003 5203300030025131251005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=000000000000&version=9767

Shame about lichborne, however increased disease duration being standard means spare 2 points from my perspective, i still call unfair trade though.
Any questions? suggestions?

loveknife
04-14-2009, 09:11 AM
I've seen some of the builds but I don't like them. I've used something similar to pre-3.1 and liked it a lot.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050020000000000000000000000305050513 5003311030025101351005030000000000000000000000000&glyph=000000000000&version=9767

Bryenne
04-14-2009, 09:17 AM
I've seen some of the builds but I don't like them. I've used something similar to pre-3.1 and liked it a lot.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050020000000000000000000000305050513 5003311030025101351005030000000000000000000000000&glyph=000000000000&version=9767

Frost tank = spell damage tank. The points you have in Lichborne, Deathchill, and 2H Weapon Spec are much, much better spent in Bladed Armor, since spell damage scales off attack power. Feel free to pull a point from Killing Machine to top it off.

antalind
04-14-2009, 09:36 AM
Im thinking about going this build, if anyone finds anything that can be changed just let me know..
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305250003 5003310030025121351005030000000000000000000000000&glyph=072414040605&version=9757

Tankkin
04-14-2009, 09:41 AM
Not sure how many you checked loveknife and i too was gonna stick with lichborne but the trick is in the fineprint. they removed the avoidance bonus and limited it to just immune to charm sleep fear, useful to some extent but the question is how useful and for how many fights.
Agreed about bladed armor Bryenne, ap bonus is great for balanced threat rotation and i dont wait for hb cooldown, ill oblit inbetween (hence ap reference).
Also although hb is great for threat burst, i have been questioning its hit/crit/miss vs oblit and found im not the only person doing so.
Google it and you'll see some interesting results...

Bryenne
04-14-2009, 09:48 AM
Nope, nothing severely wrong with that for a MT build. If you raid with several melee, and don't have another frost dk in the group or an enhance shammy, the 20% haste buff will certainly be missed. Also, taking one point from killing machine and the point from deathchill, and putting those 2 into chill of the grave will help you maintain a fuller runic power bar, but that's if you like throwing FS into your tanking rotation.

Glyph of Dark Command? I've never had it fail, and you shouldn't either, if your hit rating is up to snuff. You will get better mileage from a different glyph.

Tankkin
04-14-2009, 09:49 AM
Re:antalind
Acclimation is a great buff and imo will be very useful in ulduar on bosses such as hodir where frost resist gear is recommended for when he does his frost rage thingy, i'd suggest removing maybe 1 point from morbidity and throwing it in up there (10% extra chance to proc is definately worth the one point). As far as the rest of the layout goes, it looks good ^_^ you may find yourself starved of runic power depending on your play style so if thats the case you may wanna check how often rime procs free hb and/or killing machine and trade points in one of those for Chill of the Grave.
GL in 3.1

Bryenne
04-14-2009, 10:03 AM
Also although hb is great for threat burst, i have been questioning its hit/crit/miss vs oblit and found im not the only person doing so.
Google it and you'll see some interesting results...

Googled it and didn't see any interesting results. Oblit is a physical attack, which needs both expertise and hit rating. Howling Blast is a spell attack, needing only hit rating, which equally helps IT, Pestilence, and Blood Boil. If you want real numbers on single vs multi target hit/crit/miss, make sure you are expertise and hit rating (spell) soft capped, and go beat up on the training dummies, going for a few minutes using only obliterate, and for a few using only howling blast.

Tankkin
04-14-2009, 10:33 AM
My main reason for bringing oblit into the conversation was more in relation to bladed armor and 2h weapon damage talents and their effect on making a less rollercoaster threat per second through their ap increases and ap's effect on most of our abilities. Which was the main reason for my "looking into" the difference between the 2.
There are some interesting debates going on and hopefully more with changes in 3.1 to set bonuses, talents, glyphs etc. I'm not saying one is better than the other for the record.
HB vs Oblit debate can go elsewhere :P
and if u'd like i can link you to a couple of the discussions i have found while trolling.
basis of these convos is around talent and set bonus inc's to oblit's crit and crit bonus vs hb with killing machine procs, crit bonus etc

oddroot
04-14-2009, 11:08 AM
Here's my current thought for a frost tank DK:

http://ptr.wowhead.com/?talent=j0EZhxxzAbIoc0iost0xh

1 point left to put into either Runic Mastery (15 extra runic power), Rune Tap (but you shouldn't need to heal yourself eh), or two hand spec for more damage, or pull a point out of DnD and drop two into Unholy Command (quicker deathgrip) or Ravenous Dead (for +str bonus).

It'll be interesting in my mind to see the difference with Howling Blast being glyphed to spread frost fever and the fact that it's damage is no longer being buffed by frost fever to see this as an opener now, versus what I tend to do now with a group of mobs which is drop DnD, icy touch, plague strike, pestilence, blood strike , blood strike, wait for howling blast to come up (which should be better now on an 8 second timer too).

If this ends up being the case, I may do without the 3 points in DnD, as is, 2 would probably suffice, since it's an opener, it's rare that I it's not ready to go for the next pull already.

And for the frosties out there, I will submit this as a frost dps/pvp spec:

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://ptr.wowhead.com/?talent=jcEMoZhgxzArcocuVost)

oddroot
04-14-2009, 11:21 AM
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050003 4203300230025131351005020000000000000000000000000&glyph=241417040605&version=9757 (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050003 4203300230025131351005020000000000000000000000000&glyph=241417040605&version=9757)

This build has no points wasted on talents with CDs, except for Unbreakable Armor, a must for tanking. Only 2 points in Morbidity, but I can't pass up Acclimation, and it's not worth taking unless maxxed. Between Chill of the Grave and Glyph of Icy Touch, it has plenty of RP generation.

The only 2 points I can see moving would possibly be Merciless Combat, but they could only be moved to talents before it in the Frost tree.


So far yours is closest to what I think I would go with, with Acclimation being the big point of discussion. I had frost aura in 3.xx, but my build was also frost tank with some pve utilization and now we get to totally separate that out.

Ion
04-14-2009, 11:55 AM
I'm thinking of something a bit more like this:

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055021000000000000000000000305050003 4203300230025101351025000000000000000000000000000&glyph=241413040605&version=9757

I'm happy with the threat talents I have (which also, happily, double as dps talents when I don't need to tank), I have a couple survivability cooldowns to save myself with (I love me some rune tap) and don't have to worry too much about lobbing out icy touch as much anymore, which opens up room in my rotation for obliterate instead...which seems to be the actual intent of some of those talents (Rime in particular).

Of course, that means that my sigil is kind of worthless now that I've all but removed icy touch from the rotation (at least past the initial pull to build up RP).

oddroot
04-14-2009, 11:59 AM
apparently i'm too revved up to go home and make my tank and dps frost specs, but a few thoughts for tank spec...

lichbourne - was a defensive skill, now is basically a pvp skill, plus still has the bonus of being able to death coil yourself as a heal. Since I'm playing an undead dk, i have one fear breaker already (will of the forsaken), so it is possible that I do away with this one, but for others that aren't undead, wasting a trinket spot on a pvp fear/cc breaker seems like a bad choice. Definitely a PVP/dps keeper though.

Endless Winter - sort of surprised this hasn't ended up in here on a tank spec to some degree. Makes Mind Freeze free, which is always good in case you are out of runic power and need to silence someone. Course never works on bosses, and has to be in melee range, Chains of Ice causing Frost Fever gets a meh from me though. Maybe I've just talked myself out of considering this.

So maybe this is my tank build now:

Wowhead (http://ptr.wowhead.com/?talent=j0EZhxx0AbIoc0isst0xb)

10/54/7

Take points from acclimation and DnD and move as you see fit.

I guess as far as acclimation goes, we are tanking, anything that reduces damage is worthwhile right? If we are going to get a dual specs and be able to spec a pure tank and then a second spec to do whatever (dps/pvp/offspec), then grab all we can at mitigating damage.

Malvat
04-14-2009, 04:21 PM
new build
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0E0VZhxx0AbIoc0iost0x:paT0Mm

Malvat
04-14-2009, 04:21 PM
new build
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0E0VZhxx0AbIoc0iost0x:paT0Mm)

Coldharted
04-14-2009, 10:03 PM
I'm just curious if anyone else thinks that Improved Frost Presence is a waste of 2 talent points? The way I see it, with duels specs being available, the only benefit from those 2 points is 2% damage reduction. Is it really worth 2 talent points to save, for example, a priest one greater heal over a fight where you would be taking 1 million points of damage before mitigation? I don't plan to be in another presence when I'm tanking so that 2% seems like it's just not that special.

souljacker
04-15-2009, 01:26 AM
imp frost pres: would say its worth holding onto, you're going to be avoiding less and mitigating more in 3.1 so it would be a good idea to grab it as an additional dam reduction

morbid: i agree that DnD is great and always used on pulls and such, but something that might be being overlooked is just how often it is used, i think most DKs would agree that they would use DnD at the beginning of almost every trash pull

but for frost tanks especially apart from the initial pull its not used throughout the fight, the rune use isnt practical when you're throwing out HB / BB all over the place.

i think morbidity falls into the same catagory as hungering cold in which it's one of those things that looks really good but in practical situations you would use it very very rarely

personally ive never come across a situation when i had to use DnD within 15 seconds of each other, theres plenty of ways to get threat and aggro just as quick being frost.

lichborne: few people are saying that it would be a good idea to keep a hold of this due to situations when there are fears or w/e going around. it really isnt neccecary, if there is a boss where the tank needs to be fear immune that's where your warrior tank would come in. not to mention ward / totem etc

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0255000000000000000000000000305050003 5203310030025131351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=141724040605&version=9767

this i think seems to be the most practical ( subversion as much for the blood strike crit, (since it'l be packing quite a kick now ) as the ob crit )

Garakh
04-15-2009, 02:14 AM
I'm thinking about going with this build today, when the servers are back up. Please let me know what you think.

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EZhxxxNbIzc0iokt0x0h:wTamMV)

plein
04-15-2009, 04:14 AM
Hey, I will use this build Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EMZhxx0AbIoc0iost0x)
but i dont't know where spend the 3 point.
-> 3%hit
-> subversion
-> aclimation

What do you think? i think subversion can run fine.

Retadin
04-15-2009, 04:49 AM
I'm gonna make this type of a build for aoe leveling and some heroic tanking:
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050000000000000000000000000025050013 5203310020125101300205000305023010000000000000000&glyph=151224040305&version=9757

Bryenne
04-15-2009, 05:34 AM
I'm gonna make this type of a build for aoe leveling and some heroic tanking:
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0050000000000000000000000000025050013 5203310020125101300205000305023010000000000000000&glyph=151224040305&version=9757

Just pointing out ahead of time, you'd be better off going down to howling blast than relying on unholy blight for aoe threat. You'll find that your dps will pull mobs off you in a heartbeat once you get to heroic group pulls.

Ray
04-15-2009, 06:09 AM
I'm just curious if anyone else thinks that Improved Frost Presence is a waste of 2 talent points? The way I see it, with duels specs being available, the only benefit from those 2 points is 2% damage reduction. Is it really worth 2 talent points to save, for example, a priest one greater heal over a fight where you would be taking 1 million points of damage before mitigation? I don't plan to be in another presence when I'm tanking so that 2% seems like it's just not that special.

Yes its worth it and should be in all frost builds. The talent is budgeted perfectly. It gives the same damage reduction point for point that BB does now without having to proc it.

Frost 25M MT Boss Build (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0eroZuxx0NbIoc0iost0x:TawMmV)

This is the build that I have come up specifically to MT most bosses in Ulduar. I have an Unholy build for trash as I am the only AoE tank and Unholy can pump out more consistent TPS in AoE than frost. The build itself has a few "flavor" points that you can place however you see fit. I will most likely place them in BA to fill that out.

A few key points about frost builds:
1. OB is your main filler spell (and may be the main attack with Ulduar weapons)
2. Point for Point, 2H spel is better than BA. This is due to the fact that OB, RS, and FS will comprise most of your TPS.
3. 4/5 KM is plenty
4. Points in Runic Mastery are not really all that needed from a tanking point of view. If you are used to running with BoSanc your in for a rude awakening with RP starvation. If you have been running with out it, you understand what im saying. Also, FS is a very good ability that it should be used whenever you get over 60 RP.

What I would be interested in know is if keeping PS up is worth it. With the glyphed HB, is it even worth using the new PS? I can see the rotation looking something like this:

HB OB BS BS FS.... OB HB OB FS

Mardoran
04-15-2009, 08:54 AM
What suggestions would you guys give to this build

this build is not meant for AoE at all, but pure single target TPS (thus the exclusion of Howling Blast)

if your looking to armory me, I'm on Khadgar as Mardoran.

I dont currently have the time to RAID Uldar or Naxx really, so i run the "zergs" like VoA and OS as the main tank every week.

My off spec is going to be an Unholy Tanking build for trash because i run alot of heroics and for bosses that need the AoE threat.

i'm still working on a AoE build.

but so far
Frost Single Target Main Tank
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0E00hZGxx0AbI0b0issx0x:maw0MV)

Severnon
04-15-2009, 09:33 AM
I'd like to first say thanks to all the posters that have been submitting ideas and providing helpful criticism on proposed talent tree suggestions. I've definitely had a great chance to better evaluate my own tree and think about why I spend my points the way I do.

So from the way I've always MT'd and OT'd thus far, through Naxx25, I've always been the kinda Frost Tank to:

DnD -> IT -> PS -> Pest -> Deathchill -> HB ... then fill in melee strikes until I could HB again (and maintaining diseases).

With the changes to the trees, especially our frost tree, we're now forced to take our tree to the max, which I don't really mind. Making HB the 51 talent makes perfect sense, considering how important it is for us. With that said, here are a few considerations and questions I've come up with:

1) I understand that DnD isn't used frequently by other tanks, and perhaps I use it too often. I've always invested Morbidity for the CD decrease, but maybe its time to invest in something else. The runes used could be for something else.

2) I've never even considered Hungering Cold until the patch. Would it make more sense to let HC spread Frost Fever, as opposed to letting HB do it through a glyph? After all, if HC drops the Fever, an immediate HB would benefit from the added damage bonus. If HB drops the Fever, does it actually Fever first, then damage (with the bonus)?

3) Deathchill was something I would have bet my life on before the patch, but I'm starting to have second thoughts. On a side note, I've never taken Killing Machine in any spec before. With my decision to only invest 3/3 Improved IT, I have some extra points. Here's the thing though, if KM procs a crit for IT/HB/FS, isn't that almost the same thing as Deathchill? Would we need both? Deathchill has a 2min CD, KM procs several times a minute. Would the two combined be a waste?

4) If you take KM (and/or Deathchill) and Hungering Cold (and its glyph instead of the HB glyph), wouldn't that be a perfect setup for some devastating AoE? If HC, HB, and KM (and/or Deathchill) were used, would that mean faster/frequent AoE destruction?

... KM -> HC -> HB ... ?
... Deathchill -> HC -> HB ...?

5) I've also seen a split decision on Acclimation. A Frost Tank either thinks it works, or they don't. Personally, I'm one that thinks its important. I almost feel its a unique-role facet for us. Beefing our natural resist would seem to make sense considering we're always looking for that extra edge to make up for no shield/block.

6) Is Merciless really worth the two points in any situation? Does the additional damage bonus really make that big a difference, when you have to wait for the target(s) to be < 35% health? The spike in damage doesn't seem to justify itself. If you're at 35%, you probably have all the threat you need, would that damage be unnecessary icing on the cake? If you're a tank, your damage (i.e. threat building) is essential, but would you be carrying the fight to warrant the damage bonus? I hope not.

---

Thus far in my Frost Tank career, I very seldomly have a situation where my threat is questioned, unless its by another tank on a flat our dps race boss (I know a great pally tank that could snuff me).

The new trees seem to make sense and I think there's a lot of great winning combinations. With that being said, here's the latest spec I plan on attempting tonight. I took two points from Morbidity and filled in:

1/1 Deathchill - I know and like Deathchill a lot, combined with HC, it almost feels like overkill.

1/1 Rune Tap - I very rarely get nervous about heals, but an extra "pot" in a sticky situation never hurt anyone. (Perhaps this could be better spent in something else?)

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055001000000000000000000000305050003 5203310030125131351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=151324050406&version=9767 (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055001000000000000000000000305050003 5203310030125131351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=151324050406&version=9767)

-Sev

Mardoran
04-15-2009, 09:56 AM
on the note of Deathchill
I used to be a Killing Machine Howling Blast tank.
and i found that often whenever i would goto hit Deathchill Killing Machine had already proc'd and at that point i would have hold off using it, and i didn't want to waste it on an Icy Touch cause the crits are never nearly as massive.

The one time i consistantly used DeathChill was if i was tanking multiple high HP targets. (Think the big trash guys that come in pairs in OS) i would taunt them off the offtank and then use Deathchill and if i had the runic power a frost strike for a big crit to help build the aggro off the OT.
I'm sure that i could easily get away without it though.

jimbo831
04-15-2009, 07:37 PM
I was wondering if everyone in here could take a look at this spec for me and provide some feedback. Let me first say that I want to include Icy Talons/Imp Icy Talons if possible as I don't regularly raid with a Shaman, however, if what I give up is too much, I might consider changing.

Here is the build I've made. (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EhZhxxxNbIzc0bsst0x:TadmMV)

Coldharted
04-15-2009, 08:59 PM
I was wondering if everyone in here could take a look at this spec for me and provide some feedback. Let me first say that I want to include Icy Talons/Imp Icy Talons if possible as I don't regularly raid with a Shaman, however, if what I give up is too much, I might consider changing.

Here is the build I've made. (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EhZhxxxNbIzc0bsst0x:TadmMV)


Jim, this is more of the spec that I have been looking at, because even if I have a Shaman in the group it is usually the casters that are getting their choice of totems. The only thing I would question is how you can skip Blood of the North. I think it would be more beneficial to drop Scent of blood and Acclimation for 5/5 in BotN and one to float like Runic Power Mastery or Two-Handed Specialization. Just my opinion but 15% to frost strike is huge, I admittedly dislike Acclimation and I think 2/2 in Chill of the Grave will keep you in good amounts of RP. Interested to hear what others have to say about Imp. Icy Talons build.

jimbo831
04-15-2009, 11:46 PM
Jim, this is more of the spec that I have been looking at, because even if I have a Shaman in the group it is usually the casters that are getting their choice of totems. The only thing I would question is how you can skip Blood of the North. I think it would be more beneficial to drop Scent of blood and Acclimation for 5/5 in BotN and one to float like Runic Power Mastery or Two-Handed Specialization. Just my opinion but 15% to frost strike is huge, I admittedly dislike Acclimation and I think 2/2 in Chill of the Grave will keep you in good amounts of RP. Interested to hear what others have to say about Imp. Icy Talons build.

I don't want to hijack this thread or anything, but if you read the thread I started here (http://www.tankspot.com/forums/f175/48672-dk-tank-specs.html) you will see why I went this direction.

This is not set in stone and that is one thing I am still very torn on. I know the 15% in frost strike is huge and the loss of death runes really hurts to as blood strike doesn't do much damage, as well as 2 blood strikes take more cooldowns than one oblit when they are death runes. However, I still can't figure out what to get rid of to get blood of the north back since I need 5 points. The spec I have here was designed specifically to get icy talons and acclimation. Acclimation seems like a situational talent, but in looking over the fights in Ulduar, a ton of them seem to be dealing with magic damage, not to mention trying 2/3 drake sarth.

Personally, I see Scent of Blood as absolutely necessary and if I drop a RP gen talent, it would be Chill of the Grave. The problem is that the tooltip on scent of blood is wrong, and it's way more powerful than that. I did some testing on packs of mobs in Northrend today and found that it does in fact proc more often than every 10 seconds, despite what it says. Also, each strike generates 10 RP, not 5 as stated. When I was tanking these packs, it was almost always up and I was generating probably about 30 RP per 10 seconds with it. During that time, Chill of the Grave would probably net me about 15, which is obviously half. My problem is whether or not blizz will fix the tooltip or the mechanic. Apparently some last minute patch notes said it wouldn't have the cooldown, but the tooltip still does, so who knows what's right.

I am however still very torn on Blood of the North. I am thinking about trying this build and seeing how my threat is. If it's too low single target, I may have to get it back. Has anyone else tried a build without blood of the north?

Frankenkrist
04-18-2009, 05:41 AM
This is what I ended up speccing.

Tank spec: Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0E0oZhxx0AbI0f0isst0x:wTkMVm)

I have been running Heroics with this and it works great. Chill of the Grave plus Glyph of Frost Strike gives me all the RP I need, and Blood of the North lets me keep a steady rotation of Howling Blast, Blood Boil and Obliterate. I haven't found a need to have Death and Decay on a lower cool down. The Acclimation procs often against any magical attacks and has proven invaluable in survivability.


DPS spec: Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#jfV0VZhbexZf0hGxcdx0qMo:bALMVm)

Took this for my dual-spec. It's a dual-wield spec with a perma ghoul. Seems great so far, but I don't have the dps gear yet to really compare with other dpsers.

Retadin
04-19-2009, 03:24 AM
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0xGoZMxxzAbIocziost0x0h:Tas0Mm)
How about this one for aoeing?;P Rune Tap for hp, a little avoidance/hp from both UH and Blood.
EDIT: leaving out one ''CD'' So that I might get a little more better for tanking. Here 's the new build I'm looking into.
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0xGoZMxx0AbIof0isot0x0h)
Make comments please, I'd like to know the opinion from the pro's :)

Knyteshade
04-19-2009, 06:16 AM
This is kinda what I'm looking at for my more survival based spec for dual speccing

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050003 5203310030115131351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=241412040105&version=9757

to contrast that here is my threat based spec that will mostly be my mian spec.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0355301533003313000223101350305000000 0000000000000000000005030000000000000000000000000&glyph=212012040105&version=9757

Theprince
04-20-2009, 05:59 AM
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055320000000000000000000000305050003 5203310030025101351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=241413040605&version=9757
15/51/5
Working with this in Ulduar, atm. Haven't made the move to throw any points into acclimation yet, and so far do not plan on it. Despite regemming for stam and dropping threat trinkets, my overall threat has improved with 3.1, and I find myself passing our MT too often..

Bryenne
04-20-2009, 07:39 AM
So, just out of curiousity, how many of the frosties here have actually picked up the Howling Blast glyph? So far, I've not seen it on the AH on my server, which is making my rotation harder than it should be.

For those who have found it on the AH, how much did you pay for it? If you are or have an alt scribe character, where/how did you pick it up? How are you liking it?

All these lovely new glyphs are still a rarity for many of us; any insight is appreciated!

xKhellendrosx
04-20-2009, 07:44 AM
So, just out of curiousity, how many of the frosties here have actually picked up the Howling Blast glyph? So far, I've not seen it on the AH on my server, which is making my rotation harder than it should be.

For those who have found it on the AH, how much did you pay for it? If you are or have an alt scribe character, where/how did you pick it up? How are you liking it?

All these lovely new glyphs are still a rarity for many of us; any insight is appreciated!

I got extremely lucky picking up one of those books off the AH for 125g buyout (I feel sorry for the guy who put it up for sale, when they are up for like 3k now) and a guildie ended up with the HB glyph from it. I haven't had time to play around with it yet however.

Theprince
04-20-2009, 09:31 AM
So, just out of curiousity, how many of the frosties here have actually picked up the Howling Blast glyph? So far, I've not seen it on the AH on my server, which is making my rotation harder than it should be.


Waiting to pick mine up, there were only two on the AH for 550g/each, I refuse to pay it, so I'm sitting and waiting until a guildie gets it or the price drops.

loveknife
04-20-2009, 05:57 PM
I posted earlier in this thread but realizing how bad lichborne got nerfed badly, I respec'd to this

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EZhxx0AbIoc0iost0gh)

What Kinda glyphs are recommended ?

Magnarosh
04-20-2009, 06:57 PM
This is kinda what I'm looking at for my more survival based spec for dual speccing

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050003 5203310030115131351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=241412040105&version=9757

to contrast that here is my threat based spec that will mostly be my mian spec.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0355301533003313000223101350305000000 0000000000000000000005030000000000000000000000000&glyph=212012040105&version=9757


so far i've found blood vastly under-performing frost for total threat and TPS. are you finding different?

Bryenne
04-21-2009, 09:22 AM
I got extremely lucky picking up one of those books off the AH for 125g buyout (I feel sorry for the guy who put it up for sale, when they are up for like 3k now) and a guildie ended up with the HB glyph from it. I haven't had time to play around with it yet however.

Talk about a freakin' bargin! Your guildmate should seriously tip you for that, he can sell the actual glyph for a nice chunk of change right now.


Waiting to pick mine up, there were only two on the AH for 550g/each, I refuse to pay it, so I'm sitting and waiting until a guildie gets it or the price drops.

Found 3 sellers on my server last night, lowest buyout was about 260, with bidding at 160. I put in a bid, hope no one overbids me. ;) Either way, I'll pick it up later today in prep for tonight's raid. Should smooth out my aoe rotation nicely.

jimbo831
04-21-2009, 10:43 AM
So, just out of curiousity, how many of the frosties here have actually picked up the Howling Blast glyph? So far, I've not seen it on the AH on my server, which is making my rotation harder than it should be.

For those who have found it on the AH, how much did you pay for it? If you are or have an alt scribe character, where/how did you pick it up? How are you liking it?

All these lovely new glyphs are still a rarity for many of us; any insight is appreciated!

I actually got mine in a pretty interesting way. Like 3 days after the patch, not a single scribe on the server had learned it yet. I was hating tanking with my spec without it as I had so much extra in my rotation. I have a guildy though who had recently purchased an account on another server where it was for sale. He bought a couple there for just 100G each before he transferred that toon to our server. I paid him 150G for his time an he made a real nice profit selling the others for 250G as he had zero competion. I absolutely love this glyph though and see it as necessary for any frost tank.

grb
04-22-2009, 06:50 AM
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EZhxxLNbI0c0VRst0xh)

this is my spec... is good enough ?
what glyphs should i use ?
and btw, what is the best rotation ? to a single target and for multi targets

Malygor
04-22-2009, 08:48 AM
I still don't see why many frost tanks bother putting points in Morbitity. Really. DnD is practically worthless for a frost build, HB+BB is going to net you more threat for the same amount of runes, and allow you to put those 3 points into something useful. Pick up Virulence only if you're low on spell hit, otherwise you should drop it and plow those points back into the frost tree.

10/56/5 (http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055000000000000000000000000305050503 4203301030125101351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=142415060504&version=9767)
No nonsense, all purpose 2H frost tank build. Heroics, 10-mans, 25's, whatever. Good for main tanking, great for offtanking, superior for aoe tanking. Sure, you could float the point in Hungering Cold to something else, and swap out the 3rd major glyph for, say, Disease. Or Rune Strike, or Frost Strike, or Obliterate. Pick your favorite, the first two are the real essentials. I LIKE Hungering Cold, it's great for grabbing unfortunate patrols, interrupting casts, and stopping (or at least delaying) your casters from getting squished. Pick up gear with solid defense, gem for hit rating and strength. Don't feel like or can't affodr dual-speccing? Get some dps gear, switch to blood presence, and this build puts out respectable damage when not tanking (more than a prot warrior or paladin, to be sure).

Now get out there and tank.

Yes!! thats what I was looking for!

Tried it. Perfect. Aggro hold is good in AE or single. No complaints.

Thanks alot Bryenne. Owe you one

B0b3rMaN
04-23-2009, 11:53 AM
Yes!! thats what I was looking for!

Tried it. Perfect. Aggro hold is good in AE or single. No complaints.

Thanks alot Bryenne. Owe you one

what rotaion are u using with this? any suggestions also from other people? :P

Magnarosh
04-27-2009, 03:57 PM
the Howling Blast glyph is excellent. i really can't say it any other way.

Arvandor
04-27-2009, 05:28 PM
Since icy touch isn't as good now, howling blast glyph allows you silly rotations like

HB > BS > BS > OB > Dump
OB > HB > OB > Dump

etc. It also provides the easiest AoE trash rotation ever with lots of snap aggro, and doesn't need a blood tap like the old rotation, and also doesn't take as long to get rolling as Unholy.

DnD > HB > BB, then just kind of BB and HB when they're up =)

My personal threat has gone up considerably since 3.1. This is the spec I'm using (pretty sure it's identical to one someone posted above, but MMO-Champion doesn't work right for me so I couldn't be sure) Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EGZhxx0AbIoc0iost0x:kTaMmV)

thefiddle
04-28-2009, 08:15 AM
I found that having acclimatization before ulduar was a waste of 3 points which could be better placed in generating threat. Especially with the nerf to HB damage i wonder if it would be worth going for those 3 points in acclimatization and getting rid of some attack power. The following is the talent spec which i have come up with:

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055320000000000000000000000325050010 5203310030025101351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=142012060504&version=9704

The only reason i have deathchill is in case i need to build a lot of threat on some adds running loose in encounters like razor or something. Deathchill + HB or IT will put a lot of threat on me.

The alternative is going unholy to tank for magic mitigation in ulduar, but i'd rather not give up the increase time on IBF, unbreakable armor and the facility of HB and maintaining only 2 cooldowns (IBF + UA) instead of 3 (Bone Shield+ IBF + AMShield)

thefiddle
04-28-2009, 08:16 AM
I am sorry, that link is not the one that i intended: this is
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0055320000000000000000000000325050010 5203310030025101351005000000000000000000000000000&glyph=142012060504&version=9704

Sagan
05-07-2009, 07:26 AM
1) should a frost tank even bother keeping up blood plague (plague strike) in their rotation? I was thinking to keep the extra disease up to give more bonus to obliterate.

2) should i macro in rune strike to all my abilities or should i let runic power buildup for frost strike dump?

my armory:
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Terokkar&n=Furor&group=2)

Sagan
05-08-2009, 12:53 PM
which is better for threat 3/3 subversion or 3/3 virulence?

this is the baseline spec i'm looking at 3pts left:
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EZhxx0NbI0f0iost0g:TkaM0V)

PimPamPetriQ
05-09-2009, 08:00 AM
which is better for threat 3/3 subversion or 3/3 virulence?

this is the baseline spec i'm looking at 3pts left:
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EZhxx0NbI0f0iost0g:TkaM0V)

It kind of depends on how much +hit you alrdy have. the 3% extra hitchance wil give extra room to swap hit-gems for dodge-gems for example.
I wouldn't bother with extra crit since you will be critting a lot with this build as it is.
hope that helps!
greetings

Ankh
05-10-2009, 04:22 PM
Hi i want to try a frost build for tanking heroics and was thinking about using this, please tell me your comments and how can i improve it, thanks
http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xml?cid=6&tal=0055000000000000000000000000305050003520330003 0125131351005200000000000000000000000000
(http://eu.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xml?cid=6&tal=0050020000000000000000000000305050503500330103 0025131051005230000000000000000000000000)

Tankkin
05-12-2009, 08:13 AM
So after all that time pre planning my spec before 3.1 based on what the "planned" changes were, nothing really would give me a better indicator of what i did and didnt need in my spec till 3.1 came out.
its been out just around a month now and im damn happy with my spec.
however im open to suggestions, check me out
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Dath%27Remar&n=D%C3%B8rikin)
also, stam or avoidance? i have both my monarch crab and essence of gossamer in my bags, some fights i feel like avoidance is better others i feel stam, if unsure i usually have my crab and rune of repulsion equipped any suggestions in regards to gemming/enchant changes?

Tankkin
05-12-2009, 08:35 AM
Hi i want to try a frost build for tanking heroics and was thinking about using this, please tell me your comments and how can i improve it, thanks
http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xml?cid=6&tal=0055000000000000000000000000305050003520330003 0125131351005200000000000000000000000000
(http://eu.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xml?cid=6&tal=0050020000000000000000000000305050503500330103 0025131051005230000000000000000000000000)

Firstly, great choice, frost is great for heroics, you will hear people say its not the best aoe threat and its not the best single target, however, blood is the worst aoe threat, and unholy is the worst single target threat. so for heroics requiring a combo of both, frost is fine.
i would suggest choosing guile of the gorefiend over acclimation and for a few more points to spend on yourself not worry about icy talons, melee haste is good but 6 points can be spent elsewhere + shaman windfury totem does 16% melee haste (enhance shamans speccd improved totems give 20% which is same as our buff)
I wholly agree with byenne about morbidity if you scroll up u'll see what i mean. i'd also highly recommend you pick up chill of the grave since runic power is a must for frost strikes, which are very useful when u have low hit and expertise as u enter heroics for gear, and runestrike go go threat

Dethclock
05-24-2009, 05:57 PM
I just thought I'd give my spec in so to see if it works for any of you, I hate death knights (although i am one) because it feels like all the scrub hunters re-rolled them lol, there are alot of bads out there so any help i can give to get our class out of this hole is worth it. My current spec is Frost i tank Ulduar 25 man easy with it (never mind my blood spec I was just testing and it was meh threat) atm in Ulduar i pull 4k threat when i have bad luck and get no chance on hits and rune strikes but when i get on a roll its a constant 6-7k but also spikes to 8-9k. My spec works well for AoE threat and solo target threat, I haven't found a better threat spec yet (I can say this hold good AoE threat since I'm able to tank Thorim in the arena quite easily when i have locks and mages who pull about 6k AoE threat).

I hope my spec helps anyone having problems with death knight tanking, and if your failing i suggest re-rolling paladin or hunter : P
Also if I'm online and you really want to ask me questions in game you can feel free to pst me and unless I'm afk I'll get back to you.

The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Thaurissan&n=Dethclock)
(trinket is bad because main tank of guild ninja's all the good ones >.< lol)

Cornix
05-26-2009, 04:49 PM
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Chromaggus&n=Cornix)

I've found 15/51/5 to give the best threat while still having the best avoidance.

Jaeden
05-28-2009, 11:23 AM
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Thaurissan&n=Dethclock)
(trinket is bad because main tank of guild ninja's all the good ones >.< lol)

I could never get a good frost rotation down, so I can't comment on that or spec, but here is some gear advice:

1. Defense - Get it close to, or just under the cap. You are using the +def sigil which will give roughly 10.5 Defense. Alternately if you are not comfortable going below cap, switch it with the dodge one form Razorscale or the Sigil of Awareness for enhanced TPS.

2. Expertise - Switch out some, if not all, of those stam for exp/stam. I was skeptical about it when my tank friend suggested it, but my threat is awesome.

3. Glyphs - If you are thinking of continuing use of the defense sigil, think of changing your HB glyph with the Rune Strike Glyph. RS crits are yummy threat.

Supposedly, the best single target is Frost and best AoE is Unholy, but I can MT and OT as Unholy and have no threat issues.

Darthozz
11-02-2009, 02:54 PM
As of patch 3.2 this is my duel wielding Frost tanking spec.
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xml?cid=6&tal=0055020000000000000000000000325023503020030103 012330013510050300000000000000000000000000)

It has worked out great for me so far. I never lose aggro and can still do a decent amount of damage.

Malygor
11-11-2009, 07:42 AM
As of patch 3.2 this is my duel wielding Frost tanking spec.
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xml?cid=6&tal=0055020000000000000000000000325023503020030103 012330013510050300000000000000000000000000)

It has worked out great for me so far. I never lose aggro and can still do a decent amount of damage.


You're kidding right? if this spec is dual wield why is it showing points in two handed weapon specialization? lol


and tbh some of the points on the frost tree look wierd....

(hope this is the wrong link because it sure does look like it)