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After
02-17-2009, 04:30 AM
Im currently trying to figure out the best strat and group set up for this to be a success.I recently tried a few attempts with this group make up Tanks-myself,Druid,dk [unholy spec bs,ect.],Healers-druid[wg],holy pally,disc priest,Dps-hance shammy,fury warr,ret pally,Mage.

The dps was holding a 3k + sustained,As for the heals i wasnt paying attention.Now forgive me if im a nub but i was wondering what I could to do as to the best set up and way of going about to achive this goal,constructive criticism wanted.

We use the hero when tene pops and then a quick fast burn on him hoping for 10% when the second drake pops.Having the Dk tank gather them up and bring them into the tail end of tenebron for some aoe dmg from the melee.Should i be giving one person a go on getting these welps down or continue to have my add tank hold until tenebron is down.

Another problem is when the second drake enters the fight we get him to about 75-70% then the final drake comes.Where should we be percentage wise at a standpoint.Ive also seen people use the portals and people not use them until all the add drakes are down best strat and run down on this please?

Now we aren't as hardcore as many but we like to push ourselves to achieving this goal before ulduar hits any input helps and thank you.
-after.

Casper7526
02-18-2009, 06:41 AM
Have the druid help out on dps for tenebron, optimally you want to pop your hero at 15% or so (tenebron) so you can burn him down as well as shadron with your hero. He should only need to help out on healing once TT becomes active.

Lore
02-18-2009, 08:27 AM
3k is kinda low. DPS should be pushing 5k on this encounter.

It also sounds like you might be having people switch off to AOE before Shadron's dead? Usually better to just focus on getting Shadron down ASAP.

Darksend
02-18-2009, 08:42 AM
not in the 10 man, last week the DPS (on tenebron over 67 seconds with herosim)

warlock 4141+280 from his pet
boomkin 4056+350 from trents
Survival hunter 3871 (including pet)
Spriest 3790 (including shadowfiend)
me (feral tank) 2330

hunter DPS was low because we did not have 100% uptime on sunders

granted the group synergy could have been better, but we still got him before second whelps (which came very early) normally second whelps come about 75 seconds after tenebron lands

for your particular set up i would say drop the mage, he provides little to no synergy besides int for the healers

also, you should be on whelps the DK on sarth and the druid on drakes, you have enough time to put up 5 sunders, especially if you have glyph of devistate, before you need to get whelps and the fury warrior can just refresh it once every 29 seconds

usually shadron is at 90%ish percent when vesperon lands, we kill vesperon second however so we totally ignore shadron and keep whelps and fire adds under control

NO ONE should switch off tenebron until he is dead, then everyone should kill whelps

we have tried going inside in the 10 man, what ends up happeneing is that you kill the inside add get out dps maybe 10ish percent and the new add spawns, so you would end up going into portals way to much and never actually do damage to the drakes. Also, spliting healers in the 10 man is a pain, and every time we tried going in, one of the outside tanks always died.

Once the second drake is dead, reguardless of which you one kill, go inside kill the acolyte of the drake you just killed and click out as fast as possible, clean up fire adds, then get back on the drake that is still alive, at this point it is all about not letting the tank on fire adds die, any time you get more than 3 the dps should switch and clean then up then get back on the drake

if the warrior has piercing howl then you can kite the whelps and fire adds and take very little damage, this is also why i recommend a hunter because he is dropping traps anyway for lock-n-load procs so between shockwave PH and hutner trap the adds should be doign very littel damage

Caulle
02-18-2009, 09:01 AM
Another problem is when the second drake enters the fight we get him to about 75-70% then the final drake comes.Where should we be percentage wise at a standpoint.Ive also seen people use the portals and people not use them until all the add drakes are down best strat and run down on this please?

This is going to vary widely based off your group comp and raid DPS. I've done this fight twice now with 2 entirely different DPS groups (first was all melee, second was all caster).

With our melee group Tenebron would be at 10% on average when Shadron died. They were easily able to break off after Tenebron died and explode the whelps in about 10 seconds or less. Kitty + berserker + swipe spam = 20K burst DPS from our feral. Shadron was at 60% when Vesperon landed. When Shadron died we took portals to kill Acolytes and continued taking portals until it was Boss time.

The caster group was totally different. Tenebron was lucky to be at 20% when Shadron landed. Whelps seemed to take forever to kill off (ignoring them always went much worse) so by the time Vesperon landed Shadron was lucky to be below 80%. We did not take any portals until Vesperon was dead. Somehow did everything wrong in our kill with the caster group and still won. Heroism was still on a 7min cooldown and only came up after the drakes died, and the holy pally misjudged a wave and died. He called for a BR and we somehow salvaged the attempt.

In other words, you have to play this by ear based on your group. Some things are just not going to work for you, where as others will. I would say that good average %'s for the drakes is to have Tenebron at 20% or less when Shadron lands, and Shadron at hopefully 60% when Vesperon lands.

I still have our WWS parses up if you want to look at them.
Melee Group: Wow Web Stats (http://wowwebstats.com/hju4nygmygvu3?s=240750-267993)
Caster Group: Wow Web Stats (http://wowwebstats.com/jce5w42z3zzwc?s=198249-225996)

Malkieri
02-18-2009, 09:26 AM
First and foremost: stack your group composition. Bring either all the buffs for the melee or all the buffs for casters. Secondly it makes it much easier to bring 2 healers if żou can manage it. More dps makes this fight much easier. We brought a holy pally, resto sham, hance sham, shadow priest (fort buff, offheal in portals, aoe for adds), two fury wars, surv hunter, dk tank (on sarth), war tank (adds), druid tank (drakes). Saved first hero for second fire wall so we had it for whelps, the end of tenebron and some of shadron. Killed tenebron, shadron then took portal and killed shadron's acolyte. Don't bother with vesperon's acolyte at this point as it will just respawn before you kill vesperon. Once you have shadron down the fight becomes much easier. I think all our dps were pushing 4k+ we haven't had a chance to go back in with a caster group due to time constraints but I don't foresee a huge difference in strat

sevve
02-18-2009, 05:29 PM
Bring the player, not the class.
For me that ended up being very true. We tried "ideal" setups, but we didn't kill him 10-man until we just brought the best players and gave less attention to setup. We went with: 3 tanks, hunter, rogue, mage, warlock, ele shammie as dps, and holy pala + resto shammie as healer.

After
02-19-2009, 01:18 AM
I think im with lore on this one maybe its out dps that is low.I'm still going to try and learn this fight and push for it even if its unsuccessful.Maybe after a gear run or two give it a try then and just give a go from time to time.

Like i said we aren't the hardcore but do we need to be down right?

After
02-19-2009, 01:19 AM
not in the 10 man, last week the DPS (on tenebron over 67 seconds with herosim)

warlock 4141+280 from his pet
boomkin 4056+350 from trents
Survival hunter 3871 (including pet)
Spriest 3790 (including shadowfiend)
me (feral tank) 2330

hunter DPS was low because we did not have 100% uptime on sunders

granted the group synergy could have been better, but we still got him before second whelps (which came very early) normally second whelps come about 75 seconds after tenebron lands

for your particular set up i would say drop the mage, he provides little to no synergy besides int for the healers

also, you should be on whelps the DK on sarth and the druid on drakes, you have enough time to put up 5 sunders, especially if you have glyph of devistate, before you need to get whelps and the fury warrior can just refresh it once every 29 seconds

usually shadron is at 90%ish percent when vesperon lands, we kill vesperon second however so we totally ignore shadron and keep whelps and fire adds under control

NO ONE should switch off tenebron until he is dead, then everyone should kill whelps

we have tried going inside in the 10 man, what ends up happeneing is that you kill the inside add get out dps maybe 10ish percent and the new add spawns, so you would end up going into portals way to much and never actually do damage to the drakes. Also, spliting healers in the 10 man is a pain, and every time we tried going in, one of the outside tanks always died.

Once the second drake is dead, reguardless of which you one kill, go inside kill the acolyte of the drake you just killed and click out as fast as possible, clean up fire adds, then get back on the drake that is still alive, at this point it is all about not letting the tank on fire adds die, any time you get more than 3 the dps should switch and clean then up then get back on the drake

if the warrior has piercing howl then you can kite the whelps and fire adds and take very little damage, this is also why i recommend a hunter because he is dropping traps anyway for lock-n-load procs so between shockwave PH and hutner trap the adds should be doign very littel damagewith heroism on tene our dps is 4k+ for the duration.Does this need to be sustained?

Malkieri
02-19-2009, 05:11 PM
Ideally you would want to sustain 4k dps, just for your healers as well. Spiking above 4k is good for the aoe phases as well but if you can maintain 4k you're much better off