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View Full Version : The glories of Defense and Avoidance.



Krazen
01-27-2009, 10:17 PM
So, here I am, freshly dinged 80 and already tanked construct wing of Naxx. My defense is 551. My avoidance stats are all under 20%. So here's the conundrum....do I keep gemming stam/defense with the occasional dodge/stam gem like I currently am, or do I start to shave my defense rating down a little and gem more avoidance/stam stats?

Thanks for reading!

Hurmeli
01-27-2009, 11:53 PM
Once you've passed 540 defense, there's no real need to gem for defense itself. Gem for expertise, hit (if you're missing the soft caps) or stamina and dodge. If you're new as you say, stamina might be the best for you.

Crommi
01-28-2009, 08:23 AM
In your case, dodge rating would be most effective stat for increasing avoidance, but early Naxx gear is really low on defense so I wouldn't intentionally drop it to 540 flat.

Expertise and +hit "softcaps" are nice goal but not reasonable or responsible way to gear your character before you gain access to higher level equipment (iLevel 213-226).

dotJEM
01-28-2009, 08:41 AM
Dodge being the best avoidance stat for warriors is something that belongs to TBC, today defence is actually better.

That is in a degree ofc. becouse cutting all dodge and parry for defence (if that was possible) would obviously be stupid.

Take a look at: Balancing avoidance ratings (http://www.tankspot.com/forums/f14/42074-balancing-avoidance-ratings.html)

Crommi
01-28-2009, 08:56 AM
Dodge being the best avoidance stat for warriors is something that belongs to TBC, today defence is actually better.

Actually that is not true early on when your avoidance is too low for DRs to have any real impact, but that's just nitpicking and you need to maintain reasonable "defense buffer" anyways. Personally I'm big fan of defense as well.

kolben
01-28-2009, 09:43 AM
Of course I can't find it right now to use as an example....

I'm pretty sure recent information showed that per rating point defense was better for avoidance than dodge. Like I said, can't seem to find that post or remember who wrote it up.

The thing with defense that hasn't changed since TBC is it's contribution to %miss. I've been messing around with a lot of gem combinations in Rawr. For any gear level currently available in the game stacking defense in place of avoidance gems returned higher total avoidance. That's not to say that Rawr is without faults or that it's conclusive because my fiddling says so.

For a Warrior I think it doesn't hurt to gem for expertise if you are close to the soft cap already. The Guardian gems seem to do a pretty good job of it if you also have a decent amount of expertise rating from gear. If you have like 8 expertise I'm not sure that gemming for expertise is even worth it until you have a bit more from gear. Just my opinion.

veneretio
01-28-2009, 10:06 AM
Actually that is not true early on when your avoidance is too low for DRs to have any real impact, but that's just nitpicking and you need to maintain reasonable "defense buffer" anyways. Personally I'm big fan of defense as well.
Even early on Defense is better b/c Block Rating has value now.

For the OPer, here's a write up on Defense that you might enjoy:
How good is Defense? - Warriors - TankingTips.com (http://www.tankingtips.com/2008/12/12/how-good-is-defense/)

Crommi
01-28-2009, 10:22 AM
Even early on Defense is better b/c Block Rating has value now.

That's true, but now you're talking about mitigation ;)

dotJEM
01-28-2009, 10:29 AM
Actually that is not true early on when your avoidance is too low for DRs to have any real impact, but that's just nitpicking and you need to maintain reasonable "defense buffer" anyways. Personally I'm big fan of defense as well.

Well that very well depends on your point of view, yes at low ratings Dodge would be better IF!, and ONLY IF you where looking at the pure avoidance overall.

To me this is pritty much as examining Defence vs. Resilliense on only the matter of being crit immune, which would be a silly point of view for a tank.

What is not factored in is the block you also get, now this is quite significant if you ask me, because while block ain't a pure avoidance stat, it is however a huge reduction in damage.

These are the numbers (in approximation and without taking DR into the calculations)

Defence: (4.91)

- Dodge: 0.04%
- Parry: 0.04%
- Miss : 0.04%
- Block: 0.04%
- Total: 0.16% (pure: 0.12%)

Dodge: (39.35)

- Dodge: 1.00%

1 defence rating = 0.0326% (pure: 0.244%)
1 dodge rating = 0.0254%


/EDIT: Ohhh wonderful... Note to self: Update and reread post just before finishing and submitting a post >.<