View Full Version : Expertise Cap & Trade-offs

01-27-2009, 06:06 PM
Short question: Is it worth going for the Expertise Cap of 57 assuming you can maintain a respectable amount of other stats?

Additional question: What is a respectable amount of dodge/parry for an end-game DK tank?

Bonus question: Theoretically, which should create more TPS; gearing to max Expertise, or gearing to max RS procs (dodge/parry)?

Background on myself: I'm sitting at 39 Expertise (9.75%) unbuffed, 49 Expertise (12.25%) with Elixir/Food, and 293 hit (8.94% melee, 11.17% spell). I only have 1 Expertise gem (residual from pre soft-cap gemming) and +15 Expertise to bracers. I currently run about 23.70% (25.28%) dodge, 19.02 (19.45) parry, and 29516 (29826) armor. Horn buffed stats are in parentheses. I have 30129 (30643 with food) HP in my everyday tanking gear.

My goal is to put out the highest TPS I can, as survivability on anything outside of Sarth3D is trivial. I tank with Darkmoon: Greatness, and I am considering switching Monarch Crab with Grim Toll (and regemming the newly available +hit slots with stam).

Gearing a certain way is obviously subject to your spec and rotation. I use a heavy strike-based build; Obliterate, Frost Strike, BS, with 1 IT per 6 runes and HB when it is up. That being said, HB will be effectively relegated to only eating Rime procs when I aquire a Sigil of Awareness, thus upping the total number of strikes (additional Obliterate per rotation).

Obviously FS and RS cannot be blocked/dodged/parried, and I am spell capped (with SP/Moonkin) so IT and HB do not miss... which leaves BS and Obliterate to the mercy of the RNG gods.

Perhaps 49% raid-buffed expertise is overkill for 2 strikes, and the gem slot / bracer enchant are better used for the obvious (stamina) or the not so obvious (dodge, str, parry).

I guess the real question is: As a DK tank, does gemming for avoidance reward more TPS than trying to hit the Expertise cap, especially in a strike-heavy (low spell) build/rotation?

Thanks for your time.

01-28-2009, 12:13 AM
I posted this in the Patchwerk DPS thread:


DK Tank. 3380-3410 DPS (8278 TPS)

Long fight (brought too many healers on accident... hey it happens!).

Wow Web Stats (http://wowwebstats.com/ofwoox35eamak?s=184039-213147&a=x29fd772) 3380 DPS
WoW Meter Online (http://www.wowmeteronline.com//combat/log/391046) 3410 (8278 TPS)
WWS Parse (http://rehfeld.us/wow/tps/report/1106) 8229 TPS

Was using Inevitable Defeat with Stoneskin Gargoyle (not RotFC). Was also using Monarch Crab / Darkmoon: Greatness. Forgot to switch to Mirror =(.


Interestingly enough, I missed zero attacks of any type. I also was using Monarch Crab / Darkmoon: Greatness instead of Mirror / Greatness. Forgot to pop UA for that extra trinket-type effect, and I also still don't have Sigil of Awareness.

Overall, I'm pretty happy, but like many of you, I want to be better every time.

If any DK's out there are looking to up their TPS, speak up and let's figure out what to do!

01-28-2009, 12:49 AM
Wow, that's alot of dps. I would love to be able to hit that. Would love any input. Was frost now am Blood frost for extra dps with just as much mitigation from frost as before minus unbreakable armor but felt the healing aspects I picked up were a good trade off.

01-28-2009, 01:28 AM
I honestly can't say much about Blood or Unholy TPS as I have never put time into blood, and I only leveled as Unholy. Well, I started tanking as Unholy but made the switch to Frost early on. I actually hated it at first, but now I can't imagine tanking in any other spec (aside for Sarth if I need to).

One thing that helped though, was going to Ebon and trying out as many different specs and rotations as I could. What gave me the best DPS? If I changed this crit sigil for the IT sigil, was I higher or lower on average DPS? What if I sacced a few stats here or there for a bit more hit, or expertise?

I practiced literally for an entire day (with a few breaks). I spent 100's of gold to respec, and I read as much as I could. I can't stress it enough... read as much as you possibly can. There are 100's / 1000's of people playing your class and trying to min-max, and most of the time, if you look hard enough, you will always find something new.

Also, look over your results. Do a raid, be it 10 man, or 25 man, and make sure you log your attempts and then look it over after. How many times did you miss? How many times did you crit? What was your most used ability? I did this on a training dummy for hours. I would do 3 minute "Patchwerk" sets and adjust gear to see what sort of effect it had on individual hits and the overall.

I already know how I can improve a bit for next time. Even if I don't get a Sigil of Awareness, I know that I can increase my DPS by using UA (I simply forgot this time) and making sure I don't miss a single RS when it's up. I can change trinkets as well (another oversight!).

Keep practicing!