View Full Version : Patchwerk25 Buffed 3.0.8?

01-22-2009, 03:44 AM
So we roll up to Mr.Patches last night all set to attempt a 3 min kill. We consumable up. The MT (Pally) steps up and I the OT (Warr) stack up. Pull patchwerk and...2 hatefuls in, splat. Ok I think...healers are asleep.

Line up again and a few seconds in I'm dead. Couple more attempts and I start raising hell with the guild leadership. I've been advocating for most of the previous week that we move to a 3 tank strat because every week it seems we lose a fury warr, or feral druid that's dps'ing. That's generally after we wipe a few times to the massive damage a single soaker takes on this fight anyway. I was under the impression that the hateful was pure HP based and had done some reading and discovered this was misguided and it was in fact #2 or #3 on threat only.

So with our feral in tanking gear now and lined up to tank we down him with no hiccups. I out of curiousity as to why for weeks we have had only limited problems with a 2 tank strat and suddenly the healers couldn't come close.

Well WWS is reporting a nearly 50% increase in hateful damage as well as a 25% increase in melee damage! I went from 20k hatefuls last week to 29.5k hatefuls this week. This coincides with the fact that WWS shows the spell hateful strike doing 53.6k-56.3k while the spell on wowhead is now showing 79k-81k. Since I'm running roughly 60% damage reduction, this 30k increase premitigation would translate into a 10k increase in hateful damage.

Pre Patch
Wow Web Stats (http://wowwebstats.com/waem3amnlfd4q?ab=59192&s=325041-353395)
Post Patch
Wow Web Stats (http://wowwebstats.com/i1ksxxnxts1xo?ab=59192&s=55604-74104)

These are illustrative attempts or kills that minmize the effect on the average damage of hatefuls that hit other melee (during a wipe), and the tank change that occured on our kill.

Basically it looks like patches got some upgrades during the downtime.

01-22-2009, 08:43 AM
Why was your feral druid not taking hatefuls in the first place? They take far less damage on that fight. We did him after with no significant changes.

01-22-2009, 12:58 PM
its a 3 tank fight, thats how its designed. HS go to the 2nd and 3rd aggro and who ever has the highest health. how you survived doing it with only 1 HS tank IDK, somebody in melee should have been getting roflstomped every so often.

Muffin Man
01-22-2009, 01:12 PM
From his post, it does sounds like someone was getting instagibbed by hatefuls lol.

You can do this fight with 2 tanks. The video Xav posted they only had a Feral OT. As long as #2 stays higher hp wise than #3 on threat you're good. I'd imagine that's *really* tough on healers, but mechanically it can be done.

01-22-2009, 03:42 PM
14th Jan, Hateful strike average: 20317

21st Jan, Hateful strike average: 19535

On the 21st you only took 7 hatefuls (on the kill attempt) which will give you a very skewed idea of what the average is. However if you look at his 'out' (rather than your 'in') they look about the same.

p.s. anyone who does this with 2 tanks is nuts imo :D

01-22-2009, 04:29 PM
To put it "because that's what we've always done" and the druid is a newer addition...it's how my guild works for better or worse. Also we where going for a 3 min kill. He can kitty if he's not soaking, I don't do crap for damage unless I get rage from being hit and can proc revenge. Add to it that we have certain dps...that need to learn to play.

We've always done the fight with two tanks. Did this because of the misguided notion that his hateful was coupled entirely to hp. It wasn't until I did some research this week and found out that it was coupled to #2 and #3 on threat hitting the highest hp (makes a lot more sense then how we thought of it at 60 with "populating the hateful list" lol. The reason why I started looking into it was because someone was getting roflstomped into the ground maybe once a fight.

I picked the fights I did because they where illustrative of ME taking hatefuls rather than a short wipe where lots of squishies eat the majority of hatefuls after I die, or in the case of the one you chose where the majority of the hatefuls where eaten by the druid who of course takes smaller hatefuls. And in fact if you just look at ALL of the hatefuls he did on the 21st his average was ~28k. I chose attempts where I ate a large number of hatefuls (51 on the 20th). Those attempts show a rougly 10k increase in hateful damage. The kill attempt is distorted because I was 2nd tank which makes it impossible to compare the average on our kill attempt to the previous weeks kill attempt. I chose a middle attempt that lasted like 2min to give a at least statistically relevent number of hateful hits.

I'm looking purely at the ability rather than my in or his out. Add to it that data mining is backing up a roughly 30k increase in raw damage (the spell on wowhead read ~55k last week it reads 80k this week

Perhaps someone else should take a link a few WWS's of their own where the same tanks where used and see if their WWS's back up or refute what mine are showing. Preferably before this gets chalked up to "deep breath syndrome", I'd like to see what other people are seeing.

01-22-2009, 04:33 PM
my guild does it with 2 tanks.. chain heal FTW..
we have never wiped on him, we just have one priest on the MT, and all of the shamans/druids/paladins heal the hell outa me..

01-22-2009, 06:00 PM
if your going for the 3min kill cut down on 1 healer not 1 tank imo. this last kill we didnt notice any change. heres our 2.41 kill WoW Meter Online - The Best World of Warcraft Combat Log Analyse System!Fully support Wrath of the Lich King! (http://www.wowmeteronline.com/combat/1388326#damageout)

01-22-2009, 09:04 PM
if your going for the 3min kill cut down on 1 healer not 1 tank imo. this last kill we didnt notice any change. heres our 2.41 kill WoW Meter Online - The Best World of Warcraft Combat Log Analyse System!Fully support Wrath of the Lich King! (http://www.wowmeteronline.com/combat/1388326#damageout)

The 3min kill is irrelevant to this. We had been doing 2 tank since the first kill, well before we considered using consumables and such to try and push the 3 min mark.

On our 3:04 kill (last week) you'll see we had a hunter doing a fat 746dps...she's new to the guild and her bow broke and she was too embarrassed to say anything. Instead she I guess meleed her way to us missing the 3 min mark by 4 seconds. Next week we're back at it and miss it by 1 second. The same hunter this week gets beat by the prot pally on DPS

01-23-2009, 01:38 AM
We did Patch last night, after having read this post and some comments on wowhead and some other sources, but our wws doesn't show any increase in damage. Our DK took 37 hits of an average of 16k and I (warrior) took 10hits with an average of 19k (which is lower than normal, but then I took far fewer than normal).

The weird thing is:
22:06'23.916 Patchwerk Hateful Strike hits Shortypop for 18803 Physical. (1572 Blocked) (6256 Absorbed)

I was almost 100% certain that hateful strikes couldn't be blocked -- unless wws doesn't mean blocked it means something else? (but I can't see any buffs in the log which would account for it. The absorbed is due to our disc priest shielding me btw). And 1.5k is about right for my block amount I would think.

01-23-2009, 02:56 AM
Those can be blocked, dodged and parried.