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View Full Version : Getting Uncrittable Dillema



Zieb
01-07-2009, 09:00 PM
So I am DK tank and I have more then enough gear to hit 540+ def. My problem however is that this requires I swap some of my more recently attained epic gear out for my old blues. One example is my Keystone ring. This ring is obviously very good for tanking with it's huge amount of dodge and +armor etc... However as a DK I do not get +def on my weapon (or shield that I cannot use) like other tanks get. This is making it very difficult for me to maintain 540+ def for raids while not having to revert back to subpar blue items.

Here is a link to my armory page.
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Forgotten+Coast&n=Excreation)

My main question is what are peoples opinions on a DK tank using this weapon for tanking.
Reforged Truesilver Champion - WoWWiki - Your guide to the World of Warcraft (http://www.wowwiki.com/Reforged_Truesilver_Champion)

It is basically the only 2-hander in the game outside of the PvP one that requires 2050 team rating to get, that offers defense in the form of resilience. The downside is I lose ALOT of stamina and my DPS will get hurt also. Which is a big problem also since DK's rely on pure dmg for threat since we have no +threat abilities until patch with runic strike.

I guess the only thing I can think of to do is spend the gold to get my cloak enchanted with +def and keep soloing Slabs to get adamantine figureine drop and use it as my other trinket. Which also sucks too though since when I get one of the better Wrath trinkets like the +111stam one, I will not be able to use it since I will be required to keep on using the adamantine figureine.

I also thought that in the next patch blizzard was adding some +def craftable titansteel 2-handers, but more recently I haven't seen anything about it coming up in the patch.

Well I guess just wondering what peoples opinions are on what I should do and what other DK's are doing to circumvent the problem of not having a +def 1-hander and shield to use.

Aurelia
01-07-2009, 09:34 PM
Resilience isnt really very useful in PVE, you'd do much better with a 2H weapon that boosts your hit rating, expertise, or agility.

The Titansteel Destroyer is still quite a good weapon for DK tanks, and theres quite a few 2H drops from heroics that are quite effective too, eg:
Skull-Clad Cleaver from HoL, Saliva-Corroded Pike from VH, the Hammer of Grief and Sword of Justice from HoS..

Heck, I still tank with the Whale-Stick Harpoon in Naxx-10 and Naxx-25. Its a fine starter weapon for a DK tank.

Once you actually start tanking Naxx, theres a lot of better stuff that will drop, and with any of those weapons I listed above, you should be fine to go after them.

dwite
01-08-2009, 01:45 PM
You will breach the cap by getting Titanweave on your cloak or the BC + def enchant to bracer's. Hope that helps

Armstrong
01-08-2009, 02:11 PM
Titanweave on your cloak or the BC + def enchant to bracer's

That. Other options pre 3.0.8:

Solo the questline in Netherstorm for Dabiri's Enigma (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=30300)
Get an Eternal Belt Buckle (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41611) for another defense gem
Level either Blacksmithing for two more sockets or Jewelcrafting for Figurine - Monarch Crab (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=44063) and jewelcrafter's gems

dwite
01-08-2009, 02:18 PM
That. Other options pre 3.0.8:

Solo the questline in Netherstorm for Dabiri's Enigma (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=30300)
Get an Eternal Belt Buckle (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41611) for another defense gem
Level either Blacksmithing for two more sockets or Jewelcrafting for Figurine - Monarch Crab (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=44063) and jewelcrafter's gems


Also you could snag the Revered Wyrmrest Accord Boots instead of your crafted Titansteel boots. Would put you over 540 until you got some more gear. By the way I love it that the Onyxia Blood Talisman is in use at 80 = awesome!

TomHuxley
01-08-2009, 02:43 PM
Um, get the defense enchant to your cloak and bracers, put a def gem in your belt buckle (get one if you havent' already) and you will be well above critable.

Getting all of your gear properly enchanted and gemmed is just part of being a tank.

protonly
01-11-2009, 06:34 PM
I will note that I'm finding it a lot harder this time around to become crit immune than in TBC. Diminishing Returns is sucking and there aren't many def trinkets out there...wtb wotlk version of Dabiri's Enigma. It's still doable but without the choice of defense trinkets (regal protectorate, dabiri's) it is a bit harder...

dyls
01-11-2009, 07:48 PM
I don't think this complaint is exclusive to DKs. Certainly when I first started doing Naxx and getting drops as a prot warr I was always hovering very close to the minimum. I believe this is because some of the 'beginning' tanking items have (deliberately) very high defense on them - the legs from HVH for example.

I was lucky in being an alchemist, so could fall back on my alchemist's stone for an extra 56 or so def on demand.

WBill
01-12-2009, 05:30 AM
Yeah - the blood talisman is definitely only a so-so addition adding at best +2 (maybe +3 depending on everything else) defense. Dabiri's Enigma will give you +6 and can probably be solo'd for with an 80 DK.

TomHuxley
01-12-2009, 10:08 AM
Actually, it's far, far easier to get uncritable in Wrath than it was in TBC (druids obviously excepted). What's more challenging is staying uncritable as you get T7 pieces. This isn't really new though, often people would delay putting on a superior piece in order to retain a 2 or 4 set bonus from the previous tier.

I think the massive availability of tanking gear is just spoiling people in Wrath. It took me a loooong time and a lot of kara runs (not the easy ones either) to get close to being "all epicced" and this time I sauntered into Naxx with just a couple of blue slots, yet people sit around and complain about how they can't put their shiny new piece on until they get another piece (I'm suprised how many people haven't gone back to HoL to get the def trinket).

The biggest thing I see is that there are a lot of new tanks (not just DKs, but obviously more than other classes) who don't realize that socket bonuses are a luxury tanks don't normally get, or that you have to plow your gold back into high quality gems and enchants every time you get an upgrade. Healers usually get this too, but DPS transplants are often used to sauntering into heroics or even raids with green gems or several items unenchanted, and you just can't do that and expect to be a good tank.

Warmaker
01-12-2009, 11:39 AM
Seal of the Pantheon
Repelling Charge




I will note that I'm finding it a lot harder this time around to become crit immune than in TBC. Diminishing Returns is sucking and there aren't many def trinkets out there...wtb wotlk version of Dabiri's Enigma. It's still doable but without the choice of defense trinkets (regal protectorate, dabiri's) it is a bit harder...

Berzerker
01-12-2009, 12:19 PM
The biggest thing I see is that there are a lot of new tanks (not just DKs, but obviously more than other classes) who don't realize that socket bonuses are a luxury tanks don't normally get

I disagree... since sockets went live, about the only time I didn't deem it reasonable to get a socket bonus was when it was a spell power bonus (I'm a warrior) on a mid 60s helm. In any other case, I've found it perfectly reasonable to take advantage of the free stats the bonuses offer. The diversity in gems is such that you can still get at least some part of the stat you're after in any single socket, and in most cases the socket bonus helping make up the difference (e.g. an item with a red socket and a +8 sta bonus -- you can do 24 stam, or an 8 expertise/12 stam, and the 8 stam bonus means you've merely traded 8 exp for 4 stam).

The fight for DKs to hit the def cap (esp when 2H) I think is the exception where they may have to gem more heavily for yellow pure def gems, rather than being as common as you make it out to be.


As others have said, for def trinkets, go back and get Dabiri's (unless you're close to Thaddius to get Repelling Charge), and farm (normal) HoL for the Seal. Being it's normal, you can sweep through fairly fast, and then even reset it and go again if you didn't get it yet. Round up some friends wanting to get a little easy rep (not as fast as a heroic, but it's still a level 80 dungeon), and an enchanter wanting some disenchant fodder for dream shards, and tear through at high speed. An added bonus, when you're done the enchanter shouldn't even bat an eyelash when you ask em for the titanweave ench for your cloak and def to chest as he counts the pile of shards collected.

protonly
01-12-2009, 08:01 PM
Thanks for correcting me regarding the trinkets - especially the blue one.

I do agree with Tom on the socket bonus point. Back in TBC generally a tank only gemed and enchanted for stam. Only stam. Just stam. If you didn't gem for stam you were doing things wrong. I think in SWP it changed a bit due to some bullshit radiance thingy(I never made it that far so never paid attention) and tanks started to stack dodge but I could be wrong. It was pretty much stam all the way and you never even considered a socket bonus.

Even now, I'd probably only gem for stam unless I needed the defense but that's mostly because I'm used to doing so. I do feel for the DKs though; that extra slot a shield is can give you a ton of defense. That does suck, getting up to raiding mins should not be that difficult since most other classes don't bother and only tanks are stuck with them as being a deal breaker for invites.

Though I'll add that I didn't find it much difficult to get my war into Naxx than I did to get him into Kara. Neither was really hard compared to gearing up a prot pally to be uncrit/uncrush (back before pallys had improved holy shield)...that was difficult!

TomHuxley
01-13-2009, 12:12 AM
I disagree... since sockets went live, about the only time I didn't deem it reasonable to get a socket bonus was when it was a spell power bonus (I'm a warrior) on a mid 60s helm. In any other case, I've found it perfectly reasonable to take advantage of the free stats the bonuses offer.

Yeah, sorry, but like protonly said, if you were raiding in TBC you were doing something wrong if you weren't stacking stam during progression, regardless of socket bonus. Now, that wasn't a 100% rule, sometimes the socket bonus was itself a large enough chunk of stamina to justify getting a split gem, so you'd end up only 3 or so stamina short but with some dodge (for example) too.

I will say that the socket bonuses are more generous in Wrath, so that it's often desirable to aim for the socket bonus. But it's still a luxury; tanks have to prioritize stats, and complaining about having too littel HP or not hitting 540 defense when you have gem or enchant slots you could stack with defense n(or stamina) is just bad tanking.