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Zartanchi
08-26-2008, 09:20 AM
Got through ROS last night, and we'll be starting this fight. From what I've read, this'll be a boring fight for me as a MT. Any suggestions on gear or experiences to share?

Gravy
08-26-2008, 09:27 AM
Threat won't be much of an issue because your dps will be (Hopefully) wearing shadow resist gear so feel free to experiment with dumping threat stats in favor of higher EH/Avoidance. Have your tanks eat savory deviate delights so hit boxes don't become a problem. Finally just chug ironshield potions to help out your healers.

Inaara
08-26-2008, 10:30 AM
Very easy fight for all tanks involved. Go with your max avoidance set to minimize damage during the enrage and if you're the only warrior make sure that TC and Demo is up the entire time along with commanding. She does a silence so a good practice is to refresh after the silence ends. Again when she enrages be prepared to pop your LS/Shield Wall if you need to and remember that you can reset the fight by pulling her to the pass the couch to the West.

Armstrong
08-26-2008, 11:07 AM
I wear avoidance gear (~72% avoidance, ~15500hp, 18k armor unbuffed, low threat) which makes her physical damage borderline-ridiculous to heal.

The only serious risk in this fight is when multiple people get teleported on top of you and you suddenly take tons of shadow damage until they move away. For that reason I'd highly recommend popping a Shadow Protection pot prior to pulling, and have another ready if the first one gets consumed. In my experience at least, mitigating the random shadow bursts is much more valuable than the extra 2500 armor from Ironshields.

Even though off-tanks don't have to build threat to soak up Saber Lash, a feral can generally stay 2nd on threat. Doing this allowed our feral to MT the last minute of a kill one night where I didn't have a 2nd shadow pot and I died at ~3%. Our feral OT also sometimes will pass me on threat in the first few seconds of the fight if he's not paying attention to Omen, so make sure they are aware of that if you use one. Once I have a little bit of a lead though I easily stay ahead the rest of the fight.

Inaara
08-26-2008, 11:22 AM
As he will be doing the fight for the first time Ironshield Potion will be a much better use of his potion cooldown than a Major Shadow Protection Potion. 2 minutes of damage reduction > 2 seconds.

Armstrong
08-26-2008, 11:43 AM
As he will be doing the fight for the first time Ironshield Potion will be a much better use of his potion cooldown than a Major Shadow Protection Potion. 2 minutes of damage reduction > 2 seconds.

The Ironshield basically makes Mother hit you for 100-200 less per hit at best. 2500 armor is awesome and definitely has its place on many fights.

The Shadow pot however will shave 2800 - 4000 damage off a potential 8k - 10k burst (more if people are slow to move away) which you probably won't have time to react to.

Your pick as to which is most likely to prevent a tank death.

Inaara
08-26-2008, 12:11 PM
I see where you're coming from however I see it in a different light. I'm not trying to be argumentative, I just enjoy a good conversation. To clarify, you would be using the shadow pot before the possibility of people being ported on top of in case you can't react quickly enough correct? The problem I see with that is that her beams also deal shadow damage which would deplete the potion before the possible "on the tank port." If you are popping the potion after seeing them port on you it would be better to pop either LS or Shadowmoon Insignia/Nightmare Seed as it would provide you with a lasting health pool. Add the ironshield potion to either of those and that is alot of extra EH.

Another thing to remember is that while they are ported on you Mother is still whacking away which would quickly add up to a couple thousand mitigated points of damage.

I agree that the burst potential is the most dangerous part of the fight but I believe it is better dealt with utilizing cooldowns and a steady extra 2500 armor.

Armstrong
08-26-2008, 12:55 PM
Pop one 2 min before the pull, which may or may not get depleted before you get people ported on top of you, alternate between other cooldowns / trinkets and more shadow pots to deal with further burst situations. Fatal Attraction puts much more stress on the healers than the random beams and melee damage in-between, so an added panic button feels more valuable than a constant mitigation increase in my mind.

Inaara
08-26-2008, 12:57 PM
To each his own I suppose lol. I personally like peanut butter more than jelly O.o

Tobius
08-26-2008, 03:37 PM
I'm with Armstrong, not having a real problem with melee damage (and hating the very idea of Ironshield Pots) I like Shadow Res pots for Mother. I just use one if I get a port on top of me. Just another thing to use if Last Stand or other consumables and/or trinkets are on c/d.

Sair
08-26-2008, 03:44 PM
The beam damage is just going to eat through your shadow protection potion anyways, so it seems pretty pointless to be religiously chugging these things in favor of ironshields. Her physical damage is punishing, and was easily the number one killer of tanks on this fight for us.

You almost never die to bad ports on top of you, since generally those are very rare and most tanks opt to blow last stand or shield wall (well, at least I did). The more dangerous ports are when two or three healers get picked, and you lose a good portion of your healing power when that happens.

I don't really remember an enrage. She still does that?

Worldie
08-26-2008, 04:49 PM
The Ironshield basically makes Mother hit you for 100-200 less per hit at best. 2500 armor is awesome and definitely has its place on many fights.

Err no, Ironshields can cut down up to 1k damage per melee swing (which will probably hit for over nine thousands on a non overgeared tank), expecially on saber lashes (depending on your armor i'd guess).

The way to go for shahraz is major avoidance, dodged Saber Lash = good. Keep ~20k Hp at least to avoid being gibbed.
Don't worry for expertise, she can't parryhaste.

Armstrong
08-26-2008, 05:29 PM
Turns out we're both off the mark on the effect of 2500 armor.


18000 armor vs level 73 attacker is 60% mitigation
20500 armor vs level 73 attacker is 63% mitigation <-- Ironshield


A Saber Lash that would have hit for 9000 at 60% mitigation becomes 8325 at 63%. Ironshield provided a 675 reduction.

A main hand swing that would have hit for 7000 at 60% mitigation becomes 6475 at 63%. Ironshield provided a 525 reduction.

An off-hand swing that would have hit for 5500 at 60% mitigation becomes 5088 at 63%. Ironshield provided a 412 reduction.


Regadless, we're in agreement regarding avoidance gear. :)

Zartanchi
08-26-2008, 07:12 PM
Thank you all very much. Hope to get to her this week

Minya
08-26-2008, 07:35 PM
Turns out we're both off the mark on the effect of 2500 armor.


18000 armor vs level 73 attacker is 60% mitigation
20500 armor vs level 73 attacker is 63% mitigation <-- Ironshield


A Saber Lash that would have hit for 9000 at 60% mitigation becomes 8325 at 63%. Ironshield provided a 675 reduction.

A main hand swing that would have hit for 7000 at 60% mitigation becomes 6475 at 63%. Ironshield provided a 525 reduction.

An off-hand swing that would have hit for 5500 at 60% mitigation becomes 5088 at 63%. Ironshield provided a 412 reduction.


Regadless, we're in agreement regarding avoidance gear. :)
so you got 400-700 dmg-reduction per every single hit over 2minutes. with mother's attackspeed thats far superior to 2800-4000 dmg-reduction every 2minutes :cool:
when burst-situations come: use your cooldowns. ;)

but as you mentioned: we're in agreement regarding avoidance gear ^^

Inaara
08-27-2008, 09:45 AM
Look's like we're all in agreement for avoidance gear lol.

Kakuzuu
08-27-2008, 03:08 PM
...ironshields shave 1-1.5k damage off her hits. the shadow protection pot does not compare.

Sanelora
08-27-2008, 05:33 PM
Mother isnt the real boss here (mother is actually a joke of a boss and if you can get RoS, you can get mother provided you have the SR gear). the real boss is "the HoD boss". to get a full raid kitted in SR gear is a pain in the rear.

that said, ironshield pots are better because the SR pots get eaten by the (i think it is called) "Vile Beam". you can pop them in a reactive fashion instead of proactive one but that means that you will have pot cooldowns wasted. on that logiv, i think you need to use ironshields to main-tank.

As on OT, I would recommend using SR pots in a reactive fashion if fatal attraction people land on or close around you just to help out the healers a bit (and considering you only take a 9k hit every 12? seconds)

Your OTs wear SR to help deal with the fatal attraction if it lands on tanks. healers just need to spam heal on the main tank and less so on the two offtanks. it is imperative to keep all tanks above 9500 HP at all times otherwise there is a good chance saber lash is going to take their heads off.

Good luck and grats on the t6 shoulders for the future :)

Inaara
08-28-2008, 09:39 AM
Ya know, all this mother talk reminds me that my account got hacked the day after we killed her and I recieved my shoulders lol. Bad times.