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View Full Version : Having trouble finding a guild......is it me?



Tankdude
07-06-2008, 10:54 AM
Hi everyone. I'm having alot of trouble finding a guild that is into T5/T6.

Here is a link to my armory:

The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Alleria&n=Tankdude)

My current guild just imploded. I seem to be having awful luck with this lately.

Because of an illness I was forced to take a few months off of WoW. I've been back now for a couple months, but it seems like things are tougher now for tanks. It seems to me that not as many guilds are recruiting them, and the ones who are prefer Pally and Druid tanks.

I've been talking to several guilds across a few different servers, and I keep hearing that my Stamina and Armor are too high (17.3 hp and 18.3 armor unbuffed respectively), and that I don't have enough avoidance. I was even told that I couldn't tank any of the higher T6 MH or early BT bosses.

One genius even told me that since my defense sits at 487 defense I'm a pin cushion ready to be popped. He didn't believe me that the +31 resilence on my shield made me uncrittable.

I've successfully tanked 2/6 in MH.........

My questions are:

Whatever happened to EH theory? Is it not looked upon favorably anymore?

Is my avoidance REALLY that low, and does it REALLY matter? Would I really not be able to tank the rest of the bosses in MH and BT?

I always just assumed that when I started picking up some T6 gear that my avoidance would rise because of all the avoidance stats on it.

I never have a problem generating threat on bosses or trash. I regularly pull over 1200 tps on bosses easily. I never lose aggro. Unless we are running short on healers, or the healers are sleeping I hardly ever die. I've always been told by my healers that I am very easy to heal and that my extra health and armor make me a very easy target to heal.

I get along with everyone, always show up to raids prepared (repaired, flasks, pots, food, stones, etc) and am always early waiting outside the raid zone. I'm polite to everyone and always willing to help. I always put these facts into my applications. You would think I would be a good candidate.

Thanks for reading all this, any help,suggestions or criticisms are greatly appreciated.

/confused

Satrina
07-06-2008, 11:56 AM
We haven't been hiring tanks for months now, and the market on Stormrage for tanks is generally pretty saturated. Not sure about other guilds/servers, but there's always the recruitment forum here.

Nothing has changed. EH theory is necessary, and avoidance is necessary. Your stamina is pretty high, though saying your armour is too high is a bit el oh el.

Yes, your avoidance is low if you're looking to break into T6 content. Overall your gear is good for the first couple of bosses in MH and probably Naj'entus and Supremus, but if I were recruiting a tank, I would be looking for somewhat better gear overall. The fact that you are using resilience to reach uncrittable isn't in your favour if you are trying to get into T6. The fact that you are sporting a few pieces of Karazhan gear instead of the superior badge items is not helping, either. Based on your armoury I'd guess you don't have a lot of extra gear to swap around, and it looks like you haven't gone much past Lurker in SSC/Reaver in TK.

What you're going to find as you shift into T6 content is that knowing how to gear for the fights is now one of your most important jobs as a tank. Any T6 guild you apply to is going to take it for granted that you generate good threat and don't lose aggro - that's not a selling point anymore.

Hitting the EH minimum is easy - about 20k buffed health is good to go on almost everything through BT. After that you need to pick the right balance of avoidance/threat/more EH/whatever as you come to the fights. That means having the gear pieces ready to swap around to meet the needs of the fight.

A couple things to read:
http://www.tankspot.com/forums/warrior-reference/37020-raid-zone-minimums.html
http://www.tankspot.com/forums/evil-empire-guides/33580-life-after-490-defense.html

You might be better off trying to find a guild that is reaching the end of T5 and grow with them. You definitely need to hit up Karazhan/heroics and get the badges to get the new Sunwell badge gear (and some of the older stuff, like Slikk's cloak) if you really want to jump straight to T6.

Good luck!

Kamani
07-06-2008, 12:24 PM
Get badge gear. The badge chest is exponentially better then the BS chest. The 2.4 legs are much better then the 2.3 and the badge cloak is much better then kara cloak.

Also get the trinket from Mr. T along with Moroes' Pocketwatch.

As far as finding a guild goes, best thing I found was transfering to a big server. Servers like Mal'ganis overwhelm you with opportunities.

thedrawrf
07-06-2008, 02:25 PM
Your high EH just doesn't justify your lack of avoidance, to be frank, but that's just a tank to tank observation. If a guild leader asks you about your avoidance, give him the buffed values, and remember, stuff like mongoose adds an average overall 1% avoidance, Aldor exalted neck proc adds .88%, ect ect.

Satrina
07-06-2008, 04:10 PM
I'd just laugh at anyone who quoted me their stats including proc effects.

thedrawrf
07-06-2008, 05:58 PM
I'd just laugh at anyone who quoted me their stats including proc effects.

If I may ask...why? As far as I know, there is math out there that gives the average avoidance, over a minute, given by procs. Saw it on Tankingtips.com I think.

Fyran
07-07-2008, 04:35 AM
If I may ask...why? As far as I know, there is math out there that gives the average avoidance, over a minute, given by procs. Saw it on Tankingtips.com I think.

The point is, you can't rely on averaged out proc times. Just because a proc averages out to let's pretend 1% avoid over time, it doesn't add 1% avoid to your avoidance. It's gonna be procing in "peaks" of +3%or more, whereas the rest of the time you'll be sitting at your "charscreen" avoidance without any procs.

thedrawrf
07-07-2008, 08:15 AM
Well, there is truth in the idea that a tank with mongoose will have more avoidance than a tank without. With the OPs low avoidance numbers, anything would help.

clavarnway
07-07-2008, 08:22 AM
Well, there is truth in the idea that a tank with mongoose will have more avoidance than a tank without. With the OPs low avoidance numbers, anything would help.
Yes, but when telling somebody your avoidance, you shouldn't include things that are random in their nature.

On my Warlock I don't include the set bonus of Spellstrike, or the proc effect on the exalted Hyjal ring. When people inspect your gear they will see these things and know what they mean.

Satrina
07-07-2008, 08:40 AM
Well, there is truth in the idea that a tank with mongoose will have more avoidance than a tank without. With the OPs low avoidance numbers, anything would help.

For 15 seconds at a time, on a 1 proc per minute average. The key word being average. It might proc twice in a minute, it might not proc at all in a given minute. Even if it proc'd exactly once per minute, you only have that extra dodge for 1/4 of your fight time. That whole statistics and averages thing tells you that more often than not, bad things are going to happen while it's not up.

Including it (and any proc effect) in your stats is flat out ridiculous. Whoever came up with the averages to 1% dodge over a minute gem needs a good head shake. It's a discrete event, and treating it as anything other than that is silly.

Smaken
07-07-2008, 08:47 AM
Well right now you're at ~44% avoidance, that's not rock bottom but it is low.

You could easily trade in some of that AC for a bit more avoidance and come out more well balanced.

I'd think about trying to pick up the T4 chest and the shield from the Dragonhawk boss in ZA. You could also grab a Slikk's Cloak and set it up for avoidance. There's nothing wrong with Effective Health, but its not just about EH, nor is it just about avoidance - its about both and having a good balance of both.

Muggs
07-07-2008, 09:03 AM
Average is always fun to deal with, remember, that averages can vary based on sample size (# of swings at you). Me for example: Progression Kill of Ka'rogal = 43% avoidance on WWS (I know, right?) non-progression wipe = 56% avoidance (I went OOM and went boom XD) and my sheet says I'm about 52% avoidance at the time. Adding in a proc effect to this makes the variance HUGGGGEEEISH to the point where being the math nerd I am, don't like the stats x)

But, as other posters have said, focus on the badge chest/cape and enchant the cape for dodge to help your avoidance rating, that stuff is loaded with avoidance and will give you BT-level avoidance from just running Kara (weeeeee!)

thedrawrf
07-07-2008, 11:59 AM
From tankingtips.com, concerning the Aldor neck proc:

"Itís 5.28% dodge added (ever 45 seconds, for 10 seconds), which amounts to 0.88% dodge, or a passive 16.67 dodge rating."

I don't see what's wrong with that statement, if anything.

Satrina
07-07-2008, 12:48 PM
I don't see what's wrong with that statement, if anything.
Besides the fact that it makes no logical sense whatsoever?

It is not a constant 0.88% dodge. It is 5.28% dodge for the 10 seconds the effect is active, no more and no less. After that, you get absolutely nothing until it procs again.

The extra dodge you had is not helping you 5 seconds after the effect ends, because there is no extra dodge at that point. Zero percent. It all went away when the effect ended. It is a completely binary effect; you either have all of the dodge or you have none of it. Trying to apply an average to the discrete effect is completley meaningless and nonsensical.

bludwork
07-07-2008, 01:00 PM
Experience > gear. Looking at your armory I wouldn't take you as a T6 tank unless we were pretty desparate because your gear screams inexperience.

thedrawrf
07-07-2008, 01:10 PM
Besides the fact that it makes no logical sense whatsoever?

It is not a constant 0.88% dodge. It is 5.28% dodge for the 10 seconds the effect is active, no more and no less. After that, you get absolutely nothing until it procs again.

The extra dodge you had is not helping you 5 seconds after the effect ends, because there is no extra dodge at that point. Zero percent. It all went away when the effect ended. It is a completely binary effect; you either have all of the dodge or you have none of it. Trying to apply an average to the discrete effect is completley meaningless and nonsensical.


Hmm. I don't do this often, but I conceede. You're right in this case.