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View Full Version : Meta hat replacing ZA helm (Amani Desk Math)



GarrettJaxx
06-26-2008, 11:27 AM
Hi, I'd lose about 70 AP or so if I had got my S2 Glad's helm and popped in a meta gem with +3% crit damage. Now currently, my crit level is low, in favor of AP (2024 AP, 28.4% crit, 170 hit unbuffed).

if this dropped to (1950 AP, 29.5% crit, 150 hit) but with the +3% crit damage I'm thinking that'd be a significant increase in dps, ya? I don't have the math here, and I'm not good with it, but wondering if anyone has confirmation.

Tatt
06-26-2008, 01:06 PM
Ummm, math ain't my best subject, but...

If you are doing 1000 damage per swing at 2024 AP, then a crit is 2k

If you do 925 a swing at 1950, then a crit is 1850, plus 3% = 54ish extra damage, so 1900 or so.....

I think you are better off staying with Amani till you find a helm with as good a stats AND a Meta slot.

shiz98
06-26-2008, 06:47 PM
My gut says yes - that meta gem is definitely a great DPS item.

For the definitive answer, ask the EJ Spreadsheet. It excels at these sorts of comparison (no pun intended).

GarrettJaxx
06-27-2008, 08:36 AM
I don't know though shiz - tatt's logic above sort of makes sense to me. I mean, I may be getting 3% increase in dps, but I'd be giving alot more up of my damage up per swing with a reduction in AP.

Tatt
06-27-2008, 10:04 AM
Just power level engineering Garret.....goggles ftw :p

Prunetracy
06-27-2008, 11:00 AM
I don't know though shiz - tatt's logic above sort of makes sense to me. I mean, I may be getting 3% increase in dps, but I'd be giving alot more up of my damage up per swing with a reduction in AP.

70 ap is worth 5 white dps.
70 ap adds ~12 damage to instant attacks

It's not that big a dps change, and it doesn't scale with raidbuffs. 3% crit damage, however, does. The higher your AP, the more valuable the metagem will be, making it a clear choice for raids.

I'd still suggest checking the spreadsheet, but I really think the metagem is stronger. My main is a rogue, and know for us at least the RED meta is worth ~100 AP on its own. Since warriors have a higher critrate than most sword rogues, I'd suspect they get an even greater benefit.

Tatt
06-27-2008, 11:03 AM
70 AP is only worth 5 white dps? That does not sound right. I am not good on a spreadsheet, but for example I found 2 sites that show Bloodlust Brooch having a passive increase of 28.2 dps with 72 AP. If 70 AP is only worth 5 dps then the meta would definately be the winner, but I would need to see something to prove your initial equation.

shiz98
06-27-2008, 04:04 PM
Attack Power (AP) increases your base DPS by 1 for every 14 attack power. Quoth Attack power - WoWWiki - Your guide to the World of Warcraft (http://www.wowwiki.com/Attack_power)

The extra DPS from AP is factored into yellow hits on those sites.


I don't know though shiz - tatt's logic above sort of makes sense to me.
Oh yeah, his logic is good, it's just that his numbers are way off. Dropping 70 AP will not drop 75 damage per attack. In any case, that 3% increase is worth at least 40 AP, I'd say - factor in the extra 1% crit, and I think you'll end up with more DPS. Now, you do lose a bit of hit, but that won't have a huge impact.

I personally have my meta slot filled with the 20 AP gem, since it doubles as my PvP helmet (S3 gear is just so awesome). Last I checked, I lose out on 40 DPS or so by foregoing the crit gem.

Prunetracy
06-27-2008, 05:40 PM
AP is designed such that 14 ap increases DPS before the hit table is applied by 1.

So if you have a 2.6 speed MH, 70 ap will add: 70/14 * 2.6 = 13 damage to each swing.

Due to the hit table, the actual DPS gained will be greater or less than 1 depending on your other stats, so for most warriors it'll actually be a bit more than 5.


For instant attacks, AP adds AP*(normalization)/14

Normalization is different depending on weapon type:
Daggers: 1.7
Other 1-hands: 2.4
2h: 3.3
Ranged: 2.8

So for a DW warrior, 70 ap grants: 70/14*2.4 = 12 damage per attack.

Tatt
06-28-2008, 08:10 AM
Weird question, but are you taking crit percentage into that for dps? Example, I am running at 30% crit unbuffed presently, so approximately 1 out 3 (I know a little less but making an example) of my attacks will be crits, so that 12 damage per swing you showed will be 24. How much will that effect the original question by garret?

Prunetracy
06-28-2008, 11:18 AM
No it doesn't account for crit chance, which is why I said due to the combat table, things will change a bit.

On a crit: (assuming impale)
70 ap grants:
12 * 2.2 = 26.4 extra damage

3% crit damage:
x(.03) = 26.4
x = 880

So if your average crit is at least 880, you'll get more damage per crit out of the crit meta.

But again, that has to be balanced by the fact that 70 ap applies to all your attacks, and the 3% meta only applies to your crits. Therefore, the higher your critrate, the more valuable the metagem is.

Also remember that AP does not scale with raidbuffs, but the metagem will.

I still recommend using the spreadsheet over napkin math. It will give a much better answer.

Tatt
06-28-2008, 12:18 PM
AP does not scale, but AP derived from strength will, and actually I was using the back of one of my business cards :p

Threatmagnet
06-29-2008, 10:19 PM
I think what we should all look at first and foremost is whether the helm we are looking at has a meta gem socket. You would be surprised at how resilient the Relentless Earthstorm Diamond makes a helm. Unless the helm w/o the meta slot is from an instance past say Hyjal, you should stick with your tier helm or a helm equal to or better than season 3. Remember that pvp helms are for pvp, so you'll be trading str for resilience and stamina.