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Lizana
04-15-2008, 12:53 AM
Quick question, Is there a point that i should stop stacking expertise?

I am currently a Kara MT, trying to work to gear myself up for 25 mans. As of right now i have 37 Expertise, that gives me 9.25 dodge/parry reduce. In order to get this expertise i use the new Shard of the Contempt instead of my +51 stamina trinket. At what point should i use stamina over expertise, and likewise when should i use Expertise over stamina.

Mainly i am trying to decide if i need to upgrade my chest with badge loot ( currently have path chest from kara) or if i should instead get the New badge legs for the expertise ( currently have Legs from curator ).

Indris
04-15-2008, 01:37 AM
You're asking the wrong question. The real question is, when should you stop stacking stamina / avoidance and start gearing for threat. :)

Seeing as dead tanks make no threat, on any new encounters - unless you know full well what kind of damage you're up against and are confident you can take it - you should gear fully for actual 'tank' stats and not threat generation.

More on topic, you should probably favour block value over stacking expertise seeing as it helps your survivability more than you think, and is also a great threatgen stat; anyway the important breaking point of expertise is 23 actual expertise (not rating) - since that pushes dodges off the table so every point of expertise past that is basically only half as effective (since there's only parry reduction from there on).

All this said (warning: epeen moment), my threatset has 38 expertise and our 2k dps warlocks don't really ever overaggro me. Soo, you probably don't need that much anytime soon. :p

Oh and, on the subject of shard of contempt... remember that there's more to it than the passive expertise, the AP proc is actually insanely powerful for threat generation too.

Just saying.


sorry if this comes off too much as a rant but hope it helps a bit, it's 9am and I haven't been to bed yet :x gl

MasterWolf
04-15-2008, 03:12 AM
It's simple really... if you think there's a chance you may die... equip your stam stuff. At the point that you're comfortable that you will *probably* not die, you can start equiping more and more threat gear. In Kara especially, where there is no real rush to kill stuff, the most important thing is you staying alive so that you guys can down the boss. No point in generating a ton of threat and then dying.

Aughban
04-15-2008, 03:24 AM
It's simple really... if you think there's a chance you may die... equip your stam stuff. At the point that you're comfortable that you will *probably* not die, you can start equiping more and more threat gear. In Kara especially, where there is no real rush to kill stuff, the most important thing is you staying alive so that you guys can down the boss. No point in generating a ton of threat and then dying.


not unless they implement some kind of kick the dead tank boss move.

Tank
04-15-2008, 04:14 AM
The idea of more threat with hit rating and expertise is simple.

Your TPS (Threat Per Sec) affect the (DPS Damage Per Sec) of your raid.

As your raid dps caster/melee gear improves, your TPS as a MT must increase to meet the demand. It also means the boss will die faster if your TPS is high.

Depending on your raid make up, how geared your raid dps are and boss encounter, you should make a judgement on health, avoidance, hit or expertise you need.

WWS and Omen is your best friend.

Lizana
04-15-2008, 09:44 AM
Well for threat i haven't had that much of an issue. For kara up to Prince and Nightbane, I DW tank, and maintain around 1300-1500 tps per omen.

Indris
04-16-2008, 04:50 AM
Well for threat i haven't had that much of an issue. For kara up to Prince and Nightbane, I DW tank, and maintain around 1300-1500 tps per omen.

That's your answer then. If threat isn't ever an issue, you don't need to stack anymore threatgen stats.

mcfuzz
04-19-2008, 04:55 AM
You're asking the wrong question. The real question is, when should you stop stacking stamina / avoidance and start gearing for threat. :)

Seeing as dead tanks make no threat, on any new encounters - unless you know full well what kind of damage you're up against and are confident you can take it - you should gear fully for actual 'tank' stats and not threat generation.

More on topic, you should probably favour block value over stacking expertise seeing as it helps your survivability more than you think, and is also a great threatgen stat; anyway the important breaking point of expertise is 23 actual expertise (not rating) - since that pushes dodges off the table so every point of expertise past that is basically only half as effective (since there's only parry reduction from there on).


whatever you do, dont listen to this guy. being expertise "capped" ONLY refers to the fact that expertise is the best threat stat up to 23 skill. it is the bosses parry chance that extends over 10 percent and for that reason stacking expertise is very effective at keeping you alive and producing threat.

when you do die, it will usually be due to parry gibs. if you die from something else you may not even be able to effect that. expertise is better than block value for both threat and survivability. even past 23 skill. stamina is another issue, but with gems and enchants you should be fine. getting rid of parrys is more awesome in the end.