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View Full Version : Threat rotation and Devestate Spam



Magnum
04-11-2008, 09:08 AM
As I was doing our SSC raid the other night, I was working on my Dev, Dev, SS, Rev rotation. It seemed like i did about 50% more threat on omen when I just spammed devestate and tried to hit the others when my cooldowns were up. is there something else to the 4-way rotation that i am missing? i do know from the parse, I could be getting more SS in, but i'm still doing a lot better with "devestate spam" with SS and rev thrown in when available.

I am a button masher (dunno if that's good or not) with devestate on my mouse thumb, SS on Q and revenge on E. My thumb is just constantly hitting devestate (LH on Mouse) while the right hand works on SS/Revenge along with all the other goodies (HS, TC, DS etc...).

Am I missing something on the rotation? My omen read 5-800 for normal rotation and 1600+ for my spam (see below actual TPS much lower as expected).

Edit: Did a for Hydross and comparing to the other tank, we ended up the same, even though he had significantly more SS% then i did. We ended up the same on threat ~360.
On trash (the only thing close to a full fight for both tanks), I was up by about 15% over MT threat on abilities.

Domichi
04-11-2008, 10:40 AM
I think Omen is still a little buggy with the combat log changes with the 2.4 patch. Every time I have raided since the patch went live, the raid was delayed while everyone with older versions of the addon logged to get it updated. It does seem that they are working hard on getting all the kinks worked out, seems like there are multiple updates daily.

Splug
04-11-2008, 11:42 AM
Is it possible you're overkilling heroic strike? If you drill yourself down to 0 rage by burning too much on HS, you'll run into a rage-limitation on your threat before a time-limitation. If that's the case, devastate is going to come up about even on threat-per-rage with shield slam, especially on trash where the time you spend stacking sunders is a significant portion of each pull.

EDIT: 1600+ TPS is extremely high for an SSC gear level. Are you sure you weren't just checking the meter in the middle of a misdirection?

Also, keep in mind Hydross is not the most reliable entity to compare numbers on. You're spending a lot of time flailing at the boss without actually tanking him, and what each tank does during this non-tanking period may vary greatly without having any real impact on the encounter. I don't know of any way for a WWS parse to differentiate between the two phases so you'd be able to only view "active tanking" time.

-Splug

Magnum
04-11-2008, 12:10 PM
Yeah, I realize Hydross is a bad fight to compare, but its the only one with 2 tanks to compare and as the OT, the only one i get to do anything other than be a low dps rogue. I wanted something other than omen to compare threat. Hopefully as my guild goes forward we use WWS on more fights.

Also i'm pretty good about HS only when I have lots of rage. on hydross, its pretty much 100%. The reason I posted this is because it seems there is a "lull" in dev, dev, SS, rev or an extra GCD. Its almost as if i should be doing dev/dev/dev/SS/rev. Am i doing something wrong?

also about the omen numbers--its know its not completely reliable, but i still see 1000TPS at the end of the fight with my dev spam (which includes SS and Rev) versus 500-600 for the steady 4way rotation (there are mid fight sessions where I am spiking 1600-2000 for a few seconds, obviously after crits).

Monday is Gruul/Magtheridon day so hopefully I'll have some more parses that are better. Its 1 of 2 issues: 1)Somehow I am fooling omen into reading better than i actually am through some bug, or 2)There is a room for improvement in my threat cycle that could push me even higher than where i am (regardless of the number). I'm looking at #2, because what i see is not what i read here--somehow the rotation of dev dev SS rev is not generating max threat for me. I trust you guys that its the right rotation and am trying to figure out what the difference is and why my "devestate spam" is prodcuing more threat.

from my Hydross fight here's a breakdown: (TPS was ~360)
Ability........DMG.....% tot..Number
Swing........24074...27%....98
Devestate..22972...26%....91
HS............22506...25%....67 (Some of these are DPS phase mode)
SS.............8292....9%.....11
Revenge.....2509.....2%.....8

And trash which is probably actually better indication (TPS ~560)
Ability........DMG.....% tot..Number
Swing........89583...35%....236
Devestate..64018...22%....190
HS............48149...25%....95
SS............35693...14%.....32
Revenge.....10213.....4%.....19

Somehow it looks like I'm missing revenge about 30% of the time based on the number column (should be 2:1:1 right versus what I have is 18:3:2 or 9:1.5:1). hmmm. My SS to Dev ratio is waaaaay off though, thus my naming of this "Dev Spam" Is there an extra cooldown in there or not? If there is, im sure my dev will pick it up cause I am just hitting it constantly. I'm tried to work on the steady, hit em when GCD is off, but i ended up button mashing.

Brugga
04-11-2008, 02:15 PM
I seem to remember somewhere about how it is higher threat to just heroic and devaste/revenge than to use shield slam as well. I assume this is due to the change in itemisation as tanks move from the t5/ t4 days of very high block value, to the badge/ t6 loot, which favors high expertise.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

Magnum
04-12-2008, 06:10 AM
I did do a 70 dungeon last night and focused on the traditional threat rotation. It did much better than before. I'm fighting the button mashing habit to get into a much better "synch" and it appears to be working. Still can't explain the spikes in the devestate spam. I'll keep looking and Monday should have a good ol tank-n-spank fight to parse.