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View Full Version : Threat Trouble with Bloodboil



Invisniper
03-26-2008, 09:59 PM
Well tonight we did Bloodboil and we, well I, struggled. Rage starvation was partially to blame, but also I just couldn't keep the threat up. I was OT2 so I wasn't getting hit; Revenge was always down so I had to replace it in my rotation with an extra Devastate. My rotation was:

SS > Dev > Dev > Dev

Even with trying my absolute hardest I couldn't hold a match to the tank and OT. Here are our Armories:

Main tank: The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Lightbringer&n=Dirkalba)
OT: The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Lightbringer&n=Perdido)
Me: The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Lightbringer&n=Invisniper)

I know that Dirk and Perd -- MT and OT -- weren't blasting away on threat; they were trying to stay low, but it just didn't happen. I know they are much better geared than I am, but shouldn't I be able to pass them if they're trying to let them pass me? What's wrong?

Edit: Found our WWS for it: Wow Web Stats (http://wowwebstats.com/z3wgp5dsakuji)

torand
03-27-2008, 01:11 PM
For this fight, you really need to stand in front of him to get like a stack or two of the bleed to get rage. Once you have that, stand to the side so you don't get parried, but you don't get the melee cleaved if he turns on you.

Also, no one should be doing any real damage during phase 1. If anyone pulls aggro during phase 1 that is not a healer it is probably their fault. They can do whatever they want during phase 2, so there is no reason for them to do much during phase 1. I posted a video in the other bloodboil thread to give you an idea of what one of our kills look like.

tamral
03-27-2008, 01:41 PM
Well tonight we did Bloodboil and we, well I, struggled. Rage starvation was partially to blame, but also I just couldn't keep the threat up. I was OT2 so I wasn't getting hit; Revenge was always down so I had to replace it in my rotation with an extra Devastate. My rotation was:

SS > Dev > Dev > Dev

Even with trying my absolute hardest I couldn't hold a match to the tank and OT. Here are our Armories:

Main tank: The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Lightbringer&n=Dirkalba)
OT: The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Lightbringer&n=Perdido)
Me: The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Lightbringer&n=Invisniper)

I know that Dirk and Perd -- MT and OT -- weren't blasting away on threat; they were trying to stay low, but it just didn't happen. I know they are much better geared than I am, but shouldn't I be able to pass them if they're trying to let them pass me? What's wrong?


Edit: Found our WWS for it: Wow Web Stats (http://wowwebstats.com/z3wgp5dsakuji)


Iím gonna be harsh here, because simply said, thatís how I am.

First off, NONE of your tanks were doing a very effective job. Either the DPS was holding back, or the group DPS just wasnít solid, and the overall tank threat was fairly weak.

Here is a webstats output from when I tanked it last:
Wow Web Stats (http://wowwebstats.com/11oy3sjpjysw3?s=5875-6337)

How to do BB:

1) BB does cleave. If you arenít the main target and you have no debuffs on you, stand on top of the tank and eat the cleaves.
2) Your rotation was correct, but it cannot be sustained. Instead, when not tanking to open the fight, use SS, dev, dev. And whoever was responsible for keeping up battle shout did an awful job. In 10 minutes + of the fight, you had BS coverage for less than 6 minutes of it.
3) Once you get punted, move to his side, and use the 8-14 debuffs worth of rage and positively SPAM HS while dev,dev,dev,SS, until you get to the third position. During that time, you can easily muster 1000 TPS, even without revenge. When the stacks fade off, back up two steps and INTERVENE the current tank to try and eat a hit and buy some more rage.
4) If you are not his main focus, during the fel rage, start meleeing BB from behind to build rage to start the next normal phase. Just apply a thunderclap to counteract his stacking haste buff and keep up demo shout for the phase. When the phase ends, stand behind him, blast away until you get down to 25ish rage, take 2 steps back, and INTERVENE the current tank.
5) Your miss% is unacceptable. During those times when you are not the main focus but have the unlimited rage supply from the debuff, a miss = wasted GCD. The unadulterated stamina approach you use is outdated and frankly, for threat, it positively sucks. You want to be as close to 142 hit and 22+ expertise as possible. Hit and expertise are so much more valuable for a tank than stamina its not even funny. The healers can heal us, except when we eat spike damage. Expertise takes a lot of spike damage off the table, and not wasting GCDís on misses is absolutely key in holding off locks that pump out 2500+ on tank and spanks like gorefiend.

Consider the basic. On a pure tank and spank with nothing but raid buffs (no enhance shaman, druid) except your own battle shout (a fight like anetheron, or teron), you should be able to sustain 450 DPS while tanking. Example, anetheron. With all available buffs, a good tank will pump out 600 DPS with ease, but that canít be done when you miss 13% of your attacks.

Wow Web Stats (http://wowwebstats.com/tjor2255za3e5?s=1584-1891)

which was done with an absolutely less than stellar rotation, and unbelievably bad luck with parries (almost 7.5% overall parries from the boss with 27 expertise and 141 hit)

On a fight like BB, if timed correctly, one target will be tanking, and the other two will be going balls to the wall on threat, and it shouldnít be an issue.

Invisniper
03-27-2008, 02:15 PM
The DPS wasn't DPSing pretty much at all except during phase 2. With 2.4 our Omen wasn't working, even the most updated one last night, so we did it without Omen.

torand
03-28-2008, 11:15 AM
The DPS wasn't DPSing pretty much at all except during phase 2. With 2.4 our Omen wasn't working, even the most updated one last night, so we did it without Omen.

A lot of our raid doesn't DPS much or at all during Phase 1, you have enough Phase 2 time before the enrage that this works just fine. Hunters should still be able to do some good damage during phase 1 by feigning every 30 seconds, but that is about it. Maybe an arcane mage can get some good damage with very little threat.

Dragaan
04-06-2008, 10:18 AM
1) Get cleaved.
2) Major rage pots.
3) WF in tank group until first fel enrage.
if you are still struggling...try
4) Slow mainhand for hard devs when offtanking (mace off kael would work beautifully)