TomHuxley
03-18-2008, 10:02 AM
I read with great interest Cider's open letter on fixing prot warriors in PvP. Now, to put my own bias out front, I hadn't realized that prot warriors needed fixing (in BGs, at least), as I have no issue with running flags, protecting nodes, and tanking NPCs. Of course I have a geared mage I can murder things with when I need to blow off some steam. That said, with HKs soon to have non-diminishing returns (and lots of people wanting to kill more stuff in PvP) I can see why there would be a lot of interest in a SBV solution to PvP gear.
My guess, though, is that Blizzard doesn't want to do this; not because it would overpower prot warriors in PvP (see excellent reasons given by Cider in his thread), but rather it could potentially screw with their armor progression for PvE gear. Being able to drop in high armor, high stam gear that also has lots of block value would probably mess up many of their finely tuned end game boss interactions, and would certainly encourage PvE tanks to get more gear (if only selected items) from PvP rather than raiding. Heck, look how many recently 70 tanks already start out by getting their PvP shield (cough - guilty as charged - cough!).
Several classes can already skip Kara and jump from PvP gear into later raids (it's practically necessary to have a mage with BG gear in Gruul's), so I'm spitballing here, but I think that this is actually where the resistence comes from, not from a fear of giving prot warriors 3k shield crits in BGs.
With that in mind, here is my alternate solution: instead of having a second warrior armor set, simply have a second PvP shield. Give it 950 SBV, but maybe 500 armor and no stamina.
Some of you are probably asking "what the heck?!!", but bear with me. With just a little bit of SBV stats from your normal tanking gear, you'd be right at the damage and crit numbers given by Cider (and Armstrong). Your burst damage would be very high (at least compared to current prot specs), and your armor would still be higher than any other non-tank class, but this would force you to choose either high survivability with the old PvP shield (for us flag squatters and NPC tankers) or medium survivability and higher burst damage for HK fans. Of course with a good addon you could switch several times in a BG (or arena) depending on the situation, but you would always be one or the other.
Also, this new PvP shield would not screw up PvE progression. No one (and I mean NO ONE) would use it to progress through Heroics or Kara, let alone Mt. Hyjal.
Oh yeah, there is one more place where a tank might use it, and it actually solves a separate problem. It would be an ideal shield to throw on in low-rage situations when you are tanking below your progression level. Let's face it, you'll have enough armor, HP, and avoidance to live against the trash mobs in steamvaults even without a shield, and hitting the mob for 2.5k damage will sure as heck hold them. Better, the lack of stam and avoidance stats on the shield will actually let you gain rage faster in those situations, making it a low-level agro set almost by itself (blessed bag space!).
So by creating a second PvP shield that trades mitigation for SBV I think you could provide the burst-damage prot warriors want without overpowering them, and as a side benefit ease the issue with rage and agro generation for tanks who are helping guild members through lower level instances. Also, it would be easier for Blizzard to impliment, and would have almost no chance of messing with their PvE armor progressions.
What do you all think? If this seems like a viable solution I may post it over at the official forums. As an aside, if we get ever this perhaps the shield should be circular and bronze, and be called "Vengeful Spartan's Warshield" or something similar, in honor of the movie with the most shield-bashing of all time... :p
My guess, though, is that Blizzard doesn't want to do this; not because it would overpower prot warriors in PvP (see excellent reasons given by Cider in his thread), but rather it could potentially screw with their armor progression for PvE gear. Being able to drop in high armor, high stam gear that also has lots of block value would probably mess up many of their finely tuned end game boss interactions, and would certainly encourage PvE tanks to get more gear (if only selected items) from PvP rather than raiding. Heck, look how many recently 70 tanks already start out by getting their PvP shield (cough - guilty as charged - cough!).
Several classes can already skip Kara and jump from PvP gear into later raids (it's practically necessary to have a mage with BG gear in Gruul's), so I'm spitballing here, but I think that this is actually where the resistence comes from, not from a fear of giving prot warriors 3k shield crits in BGs.
With that in mind, here is my alternate solution: instead of having a second warrior armor set, simply have a second PvP shield. Give it 950 SBV, but maybe 500 armor and no stamina.
Some of you are probably asking "what the heck?!!", but bear with me. With just a little bit of SBV stats from your normal tanking gear, you'd be right at the damage and crit numbers given by Cider (and Armstrong). Your burst damage would be very high (at least compared to current prot specs), and your armor would still be higher than any other non-tank class, but this would force you to choose either high survivability with the old PvP shield (for us flag squatters and NPC tankers) or medium survivability and higher burst damage for HK fans. Of course with a good addon you could switch several times in a BG (or arena) depending on the situation, but you would always be one or the other.
Also, this new PvP shield would not screw up PvE progression. No one (and I mean NO ONE) would use it to progress through Heroics or Kara, let alone Mt. Hyjal.
Oh yeah, there is one more place where a tank might use it, and it actually solves a separate problem. It would be an ideal shield to throw on in low-rage situations when you are tanking below your progression level. Let's face it, you'll have enough armor, HP, and avoidance to live against the trash mobs in steamvaults even without a shield, and hitting the mob for 2.5k damage will sure as heck hold them. Better, the lack of stam and avoidance stats on the shield will actually let you gain rage faster in those situations, making it a low-level agro set almost by itself (blessed bag space!).
So by creating a second PvP shield that trades mitigation for SBV I think you could provide the burst-damage prot warriors want without overpowering them, and as a side benefit ease the issue with rage and agro generation for tanks who are helping guild members through lower level instances. Also, it would be easier for Blizzard to impliment, and would have almost no chance of messing with their PvE armor progressions.
What do you all think? If this seems like a viable solution I may post it over at the official forums. As an aside, if we get ever this perhaps the shield should be circular and bronze, and be called "Vengeful Spartan's Warshield" or something similar, in honor of the movie with the most shield-bashing of all time... :p