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View Full Version : Slow Weapons and tanking



Elyrion
12-23-2007, 09:48 AM
I know that fast weapons tend to be better overall for tanking, but I am wondering about the value, with devestate now, of the value of slower weapons. More specifically, I am considering battlgrounds for one of the slow gladiatior one handers (2.6 sec). Is it worth it? I currently use the Retainer's Blade.


BTW, this is my first post even though I have been reading this forums for several months. Thanks very much for such an invaluable resource!

Ceravantes
12-23-2007, 10:03 AM
Depends on the situation really. I would never use a slow weapon in any fight where I was not rage starved, the gain from dumping rage into fast HS's is to great. It is def a good thing to grab a slow wepon for situational use though.

Elyrion
12-23-2007, 11:22 AM
Ahh, good point.

One thing I should add is that I do I OT mostly and my guild is currently in Kara. So, while I do actually tank boss types or extra mobs, I often am dpsing and don't end up with tons of rage I need to dump. If I do, I guess I could also easily swap out mid-fight, too (hmmm...maybe a macro for this). It also means that I'll be passing on King's Defender when it drops for the MT the first time. (We are getting Chess weekly).

Anyone tried it -- either the slower weapon or switching them out? I really don't want to spend the time farming honor for it if it won't be beneficial.

Thanks again!

Link
12-23-2007, 11:40 AM
A slow weapon is generally better for OTing because you won't have the rage to heroic strike at all. You will be mostly spamming devastate. I wouldn't waste the time or honor farming for the 1 hander personally. Get the 1 handed axe from prince and you'll have a nice weapon for devastate spam and a nice weapon to pull with.

Mattdamon
12-24-2007, 09:00 AM
I am useing Gromtors charge at the moment
Suneater and Kings never drops :(
my guild wants me to do ZA now
my armor is up to it but my one hander (grom tors) doesnt seem to be up to it
would it be worth getting a S1 one hander for a temp fix for that extra DPS

Ceravantes
12-25-2007, 05:31 AM
I am useing Gromtors charge at the moment
Suneater and Kings never drops :(
my guild wants me to do ZA now
my armor is up to it but my one hander (grom tors) doesnt seem to be up to it
would it be worth getting a S1 one hander for a temp fix for that extra DPS

If it was me, I wouldn't.

Andromedea
12-26-2007, 06:52 PM
I am useing Gromtors charge at the moment
Suneater and Kings never drops :(
my guild wants me to do ZA now
my armor is up to it but my one hander (grom tors) doesnt seem to be up to it
would it be worth getting a S1 one hander for a temp fix for that extra DPS

Gromtor's is a damn good mitigation tanking MH actually with the right stats, just under the Kings. I'd stick with it, its by no means a poor choice.

If you want a faster weapon for aggro, you can also get Latro's Shifting Sword (BM) or Blackout Truncheon (SL). Both easily obtainable blues.

I wouldn't bother with upgrades until Kings or Suneater drop.

Kream
12-27-2007, 09:59 AM
I know that fast weapons tend to be better overall for tanking, but I am wondering about the value, with devestate now, of the value of slower weapons. More specifically, I am considering battlgrounds for one of the slow gladiatior one handers (2.6 sec). Is it worth it? I currently use the Retainer's Blade.


BTW, this is my first post even though I have been reading this forums for several months. Thanks very much for such an invaluable resource!

I recently got the S1 cleaver and I also have the KD. You won't see a huge jump in devastate damage from swapping from KD to S1 cleaver. It certainly isn't worth using for tanking as the threat increase you get from higher damage devastates is negated by the higher cost of HS and less consistent rage generation. For your DW DPS set it will be an improvement but won't be incredible. The 2.6 speed weapon will also make PPM enchants such as Executioner go off more for a lot of uptime.

Arlana
12-27-2007, 10:18 AM
I was using the sword off the durn quest out in nagrand(pretty sad). But i checked out the rankings of items and what was available. I ended up grabbing a Blade of the Unrequited and just throwing in 3 star's. That's 49 stam and nearly 90dps. I don't think i'll be replacing that until i get a kings or a suneater.

edit: If you look at the EH charts for weapons, this one is the highest for it's gear level: 1084.06...Kings defender has 821.55 EH but without gemming and comes with good avoidance baseline.

Melange
12-27-2007, 12:39 PM
Daggers were some of the best tanking weapons pre-BC and should still not be overlooked. The only real negative to using a dagger, is that Devastate will be normalized at 1.7 instead of 2.4. Which just means that you lose around 29% of the damage that AP adds to Devastate.

If you assume that you have 1000 AP, 10% crit, and the mob has 30% armor reduction, that is 1000/14/2*.7*.7*1.1 = 19.25 damage lost per Devastate. I think that math is correct.

Careis
12-27-2007, 01:02 PM
I managed in one week to pick up a suneater, KD, fools bane, decap, and an emerald ripper, ive tried them all, and by far the weapon i use the most is the KD (partly because im a gnome and its bigger than i am which i love) but i notice a drop in my threat using a slow weapon due to no HS spam, but when im ot'ing, or soloing i always put my decap in my main hand simply for the much much larger devs. nothing like seeing a 800 dev crit followed by a 1100 HS and seeing yourself spike up to just below the MT in threat.

If you cant get your hands on a decap though i would argue that the S1 slow weaps would do you just as good, if not better due to the better stats, as the stats on decap are...horrible thanks to that odd on use effect.

Ingolfapgi
12-30-2007, 10:38 AM
So where does Warbringer fit in the scheme of things?

chops
01-29-2008, 11:17 AM
I managed in one week to pick up a suneater, KD, fools bane, decap, and an emerald ripper, ive tried them all, and by far the weapon i use the most is the KD (partly because im a gnome and its bigger than i am which i love) but i notice a drop in my threat using a slow weapon due to no HS spam, but when im ot'ing, or soloing i always put my decap in my main hand simply for the much much larger devs. nothing like seeing a 800 dev crit followed by a 1100 HS and seeing yourself spike up to just below the MT in threat.

If you cant get your hands on a decap though i would argue that the S1 slow weaps would do you just as good, if not better due to the better stats, as the stats on decap are...horrible thanks to that odd on use effect.

Man, i'm so hating you (Careis) at the moment.... Only gotten my Suneater after nearly 30 (a full month's worth) Hero Mech runs, KD still isn't dropping for me, & i've yet to see Decap drop in my kara groups.

Back to the topic at hand, I would echo Andromeda & suggest u give Latro's Shifting Sword (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28189) a try. It has a slightly higher DPS than Grom'tor, plus it has a very nice Expertise rating on it & one of the fastest swords in-game @ 1.4 speed. It served me well, & even preferred using it sometimes even after I'd gotten hold of Emerald Ripper (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28524) due to the better dps i did with Latro's due to fewer misses (Dag skill wasn't maed out at the time).

Oh yeah, another option would be the lesser know sword Warp-Storm Warblade (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28400) Off Nexus Prince Shaffar (on Heroic) which is a more "conventional" tankin MH (decent hit rating on it) than Latro's is.

ebs2002
01-29-2008, 12:42 PM
So where does Warbringer fit in the scheme of things?

As an orc, I place Warbringer above Sun Eater, and maybe over the King's Defender (although I don't have KD so I can't compare the two) for threat, because with the +5expertise while using Axes, you are considerably closer to getting expertise-capped than a non-orc, non-human.

If you aren't an orc warrior, the Warbringer is a worse threat weapon, because its slower swing speed and lower damage doesn't make up for the +7hit on it.

This also depends on your armor situation. If you have one of the 1.5speed daggers or the 1.4speed sword, and you're able to spam HS on every swing, that will be better than almost anything slower. Once your armor starts getting up there (I noticed it around 15000 for Heroics), the higher DPS but slower swinging weapons with +hit/+expertise are better for your threat.

Irghen
01-29-2008, 02:51 PM
I'm going to be an awful person and tell you to go run Kara without rogues so you can get your hands on a Spiteblade, I got lucky on it and now I take it whenever I'm OTing, the fight needs me to go DPS or I'm farming. Devastate, devastate, devastate!

As for MTing with it, I only do it in heroics and then only with good groups where I can get away with charging into the mobs instead of pulling.