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Ciderhelm
09-10-2007, 05:39 AM
[Melee Combat] Riddle me this - Parry Mechanics - Elitist Jerks (http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t15257-melee_combat_riddle_me_parry_mechanics/)

Very good read with a lot of parsed data. It goes back and defines the old rule with a few caveats that explain the variation.

Would love to have that guy's ping...

Arrivan
09-10-2007, 05:48 AM
I skimmed over the whole thread. Fascinating read, and the implications of it are significant. I wish I had that kind of ping too, being on the other side of the Pacific from the server sucks. I have enough trouble with the global cooldown =(

Narshe
09-10-2007, 05:52 AM
How much ping do you guys are u talking about?
Want to know if Im lucky or my conn sux ^^

Klimpen
09-10-2007, 05:52 AM
Interesting read, thanks for linking that Cider. Huge data samples there from a glance.


I have enough trouble with the global cooldown =(

Me too, I've been trying out /stopcasting macros for instants recently, seems to work alright.

Narshe
09-10-2007, 05:59 AM
What's that "/stopcasting" thing?

Arrivan
09-10-2007, 05:59 AM
I have /stopcasting macros for my pally's healing spells, but haven't tried them on my warrior. I might look into that. Also, just to satisfy anyone's curiosity, my average ping from Australia is 400-500ms in a populated area like Shattrath. So, the GCD goes from 1.5 sec to more than 2 sec, it's quite a challenge to work around, and as a result I have missed Shield Blocks and been crushed before I can use it =P. Fortunately it was only on Maiden that I recall this happening, so my healers could keep me alive.

Arrivan
09-10-2007, 06:03 AM
I'm assuming an example of that would be something like this:

/stopcasting
/cast Sunder Armor

/stopcasting
/cast Shield Block (or Holy Shield, depending on the class)

or my pally's healing macro
/stopcasting
/cast Holy Light

What it does is stop whatever you are "casting" and cast the new ability. Casters use these macros to cut down on extra casting time caused by latency, usually in combination with some kind of casting bar addon that shows latency (like Quartz). However, in the case of spells with cast times, it does mean you can't spam the button and have it work, as it will interrupt your casting each time you press it.

I'd be curious to see what kind of /stopcasting macros you're using, Klimpen, and how they work for you. I haven't played around with them for my warrior yet.

Stonehoof
09-10-2007, 07:22 AM
There is alot of information on /stopcasting on the US mage forums. According to them, there is a inherient delay built into the game in order to equalize those with fast connection versus those with slow connections.

Its an interesting read

Klimpen
09-10-2007, 08:16 AM
They work quite well, I still wait for the GCD to complete, but sometimes I'm lagging badly enough that the ability hasn't triggered anyway when the GCD is complete. Then I can just continue with my rotations as if I wasn't lagging.

I havn't tested it very well, you might be able to Start your next ability midGCD (because I have heard that /stopcasting resets the GCD at your end)

Stonehoof
09-10-2007, 09:19 AM
I have definitly seen the difference when using the /stopcasting when i play my mage, but I dont see how they could effect instant cast abilities like Sunder Armor. /stopcasting from my understanding wont get you by the Global cooldown. It just stop the casting bar client side when it has already finished server side and lets the spell cast half a second faster

Nicki
09-10-2007, 10:13 AM
hmm would stop casting help a slam DPS rotation :O?

Mozman
09-11-2007, 12:27 AM
I used to have /stopcasting in front of the universal interrupt macro in the sticky - so that it would help cut down the time to cast the pummel or shield bash, as I'm aussie too and usually run 400 ms or so. In the end I found I was spamming it anyway so best not to have it if you're going to do so..

Mozman
09-11-2007, 12:30 AM
hmm would stop casting help a slam DPS rotation :O?

no, but using quartz as above will so you can time your swing to land immediately after a white one has..

Pizoi
09-12-2007, 06:29 AM
The problem with using stopcasting as a Warrior in my experience is that if you spam your keys like me, it will unqueue Heroic Strike.

Armstrong
09-12-2007, 11:24 AM
For what it's worth, I've played around for about an hour last night trying to see a difference between using /stopcasting and going without it. In the end I wasn't able to tell the difference.

The testing I did was based around trying to consistently use three instants (Sunder / Devastate) between every Shield Slam while watching for the Shield Slam cooldown animation to be "overwritten" by the global cooldown animation, indicating that the 3rd Sunder / Devastate was started less than 1.5 sec before the end of the SS cooldown.

With or without /stopcasting, I would randomly fail and succeed, without any trend towards one working better than the other. I also observed that on certain occasions where it looked like I had "beat" the lag and would be able to hit SS exactly 6sec after the last one, I hit the SS button when both the global cooldown and the SS cooldown were clearly completed and would still get an "Ability not ready" message. Very annoying. :P

Part of my problem with observing a difference with /stopcasting may have to do with the fact that my latency rarely goes above 100ms, and as such there's not that much lag to fight in the first place. Regardless, as much as I tried to be precise or spam my buttons like a madman, the majority of the time I would still be unable to get three Sunders / Devastates in between Shield Slams without delaying the second Shield Slam by a small amount. But then sometimes I would get a perfect rotation, with and without /stopcasting.

WTB better testing procedure.

phaze
09-19-2007, 07:50 AM
I used to have /stopcasting in front of the universal interrupt macro in the sticky - so that it would help cut down the time to cast the pummel or shield bash

I use /stopcasting here as well, as added insurance that latency is not stalling my school lockout.


For what it's worth, I've played around for about an hour last night trying to see a difference between using /stopcasting and going without it. In the end I wasn't able to tell the difference.
....
WTB better testing procedure.
Looks like you were trying to use /stopcasting on abilities sharing the GCD. With similar latency to what you mentioned, my experience is the same as yours: it's not much use here.

However, I've had excellent results from using /stopcasting on abilities that are not tied to the GCD. Stance changes in particular are much much more responsive. Instead of getting "Ability not ready" messages, I can reliably change stance instantly after any ability tied to the GCD.