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MasterWolf
08-23-2007, 06:00 AM
I'm sure it's located somewhere... I just couldn't find it. Can someone explain Hit Rating for a tank? It's usefulness, increase in DPS, and what the cap is. My main problem right now is my SS is missing my target, and that's really annoying.

Gingamok
08-23-2007, 07:08 AM
Roughly speaking
1% hit will increase your TPS by about 1%.
I think it stops being useful on raid bosses at 8.6% hit (110 ish rating?)

For my own tastes I like to weight 1% hit at around 30 block value / 60 AP

TheZ
08-23-2007, 07:12 AM
In the long run hit rating is really great for a tank because of three reasons:
1) Less misses equates into more threat output
2) Less misses equates to less 'wasted' rage from missing
3) Rage generation is incresed from white attacks due to less misses

From what I know +1% Hit = +1% Threat, -1% Wasted threat, +1% Rage generated from white damage.

MasterWolf
08-23-2007, 07:27 AM
Hmm, but it also affects Yellow dmg, right? Cause man, when my SSs miss, I feel like only half a tank.

TheZ
08-23-2007, 07:30 AM
Yes

Daylanor
08-23-2007, 08:34 AM
130 hit rating is about 8.6% hit.

Syana
08-23-2007, 10:45 PM
The only problem is.. to get that high in hit rating, you're giving up a lot of stamina.

Flintridge
08-23-2007, 11:47 PM
I've talked alot with other wars in my guild about this. As syana mentioned the loss of stam atm is my concern. What do ya'll suggest gear wise to get a decent amount of +hit?

Daylanor
08-24-2007, 02:41 AM
1) 8 hit gem on engineering gun
2) Engineering tanking helmet
3) When you feel like you need the extra hit replace you're rings/neck/trinket with something with stamina and hit.

4) Prot warriors 41pt should be 5% hit on sunder/revenge/shield slam.

Aelvain
08-28-2007, 12:14 AM
Roughly speaking
1% hit will increase your TPS by about 1%.
I think it stops being useful on raid bosses at 8.6% hit (110 ish rating?)

For my own tastes I like to weight 1% hit at around 30 block value / 60 AP

You actually don't want to go much past ~5.6% hit, as any extra will affect only white damage.

As far as comparing stats in terms of equal threat-gen, there is actually a much, much bigger difference in overall threat generation. Assuming an encounter that allows the optimum threat cycle (SS, Rev, Dev, Dev) and Heroic Strike every swing, the rough conversions are: 1% hit = 65 block value (50 from gear + shield mastery) = 100 AP. The less you're able to use heroic strike, the larger portion of your threat shield slam and devastate will take up, meaning block value will become a little more valuable, taking about 52 after shield mastery to be equivalent to 1% hit, while AP still does little for your overall threat.

So, the gain vs. the cost (in terms of itemization cost) in comparing the 3 stats is pretty enormously different. If you're in need of more threat, + hit (and more than likely weapon skill, though this is harder to obtain) is the way to go.

Edit: These conversions were done (and rounded slightly) using the warrior tps spreadsheet plugging in my stats (average t4 tanking gear), posted on EJ by Punscho: threatdown-beta-3.xls (http://www.mediafire.com/?aav4ezarkdd)

thugthedum
08-31-2007, 02:21 PM
Working Theories of Theorycrafting as of 2.1 - Elitist Jerks (http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t12855-working_theories_theorycrafting_2_1_a/)

9 is the new 8.6.

Elitist Jerks - View Single Post - [Rogue/Warrior] Weapon Skill Adjustment Discussion (http://elitistjerks.com/456667-post383.html)

Though, points about enough hit to ensure your instants land being more important than getting all of your auto-attacks to land are probably still equally valid.

Alegnaa
09-27-2007, 10:59 AM
Right now my hit rating is a lowly 36 (2.28%) and I've been wondering about this a lot too. Seems like I'm trying to juggle keeping AP and hit up, along with all the defense stats, and it's tight. But if I read everything right, the one to sacrifice would be +crit. It doesn't matter if we crit, as long as we land the blows. So I think I need to swap out some gems to increase my hit rating. Does that sound right?

Oda
09-27-2007, 12:26 PM
Right now my hit rating is a lowly 36 (2.28%) and I've been wondering about this a lot too. Seems like I'm trying to juggle keeping AP and hit up, along with all the defense stats, and it's tight. But if I read everything right, the one to sacrifice would be +crit. It doesn't matter if we crit, as long as we land the blows. So I think I need to swap out some gems to increase my hit rating. Does that sound right?

Hit is superior to Crit for a tank, for two reasons.

1) The ratio for hit makes hit easier to come by (hit is 15.8:1, rather than crit's 22.1:1).

2) A warrior generally gets somewhere between 50% and 60% of their threat from actual damage, and the rest from innate threat (this was estimated in EJ through several WWS parses from BT-level tanks--warriors in earlier raid instances probably generate less of their threat from damage).

A crit Shield Slam, for example, does not do twice the threat of a regular Shield Slam, owing to Shield Slam's innate 300-some threat. Same with Devastate, Heroic Strike, etc.

Crit has no affect at all on Sunder Armor, but Hit does.

And so on.

Crit isn't useless for threat generation, but it is surpassed by Hit.

For similar reasons, I'd think that AP isn't a terribly useful threat stat, either, at least not compared to Hit (Shield Slam doesn't generate any extra damage off AP, for example).